We've only explored about 10% 10% of the
ocean volume. Wow. The large territory
of the ocean that we know nothing about
really points in the direction that
that's probably where they are. What
would they be for you?
Undersea alien bases.
Tim Galidet. You were the Navy's chief
oceanographer.
>> Yes. And I was a onestar admiral and I
saw on the Navy Secret Network the Go
Fast video.
>> Oh my gosh, dude. Wow.
>> That was the day everything changed for
me. There's this teardrop shaped looking
UAP 20 ft lengthwise or so. It surfaces
out of the water and there's no
disturbance of the water and after a few
moments it just went. It looked like it
was being lifted like gravity in
reverse. Really? That's basically
disclosure right there. I went out in
the middle of the Baltic Sea kind of
smack dab between Sweden and Finland and
it looks like the Millennium Falcon.
We've located them, but it's hard to
actually extract them because it's like
they have a life of their own.
>> You lost GPS.
>> Harold Malgrren talked about actually
holding the pieces from this crash and
that it came down, I guess, out of the
plume of this nuclear blast in 1962.
>> Do you know about this bluegill triple
prime test?
>> I helped Jeff Krookchank write the
report on it.
>> Oh, wow.
>> Yeah. Did you think that something
anomalous was recovered within the deck?
I do. It's like an accumulation of
evidence. So,
>> yeah. And then these divers claimed that
they saw UFO occupants outside these two
saucers and that they even took video of
it.
A recent development for me and it's
exciting. We believe we found a region
in the Atlantic with features that
correspond to exactly how Plato
described it.
>> Atlantis. Maybe we might be diving on
that thing real soon.
>> Ignition sequence.
>> How is this possible?
>> Nothing too unusual about that.
Their existence cannot longer be denied.
>> All right.
I have uh an admiral here. I have Tim
Galedet. Uh is it fair to say you were
basically the Navy's chief
oceanographer? That's right. You were an
administrator of Noah as well, the
National uh Oceanic and Atmospheric
Administration.
>> Correct.
>> I owe you an apology. I don't know if
you know about this or what I'm about to
say.
>> No, I don't.
>> When you testified before Congress,
>> you were behind me.
>> I was sitting behind you and like an
idiot, I was chewing gum. And I I
deserved to, you know, slapped up the
back side of my head or something for
that because I, you know, just wasn't
cool. I didn't know I was being
televised. I know I was in the shot. So,
I apologize.
>> You were front row, right?
>> I was front row. I I thought I was cut
off.
>> Yeah. All All the cameras are at an
angle. Yeah.
>> So, there's a lot of shots where you're
right there.
>> Well, I I apologize publicly. I'm
shaming myself.
>> As far as I'm concerned, it was a good
look. Uh you have a very interesting
family history and I want to talk about
it. Um who is Peter Wallace Galedet?
>> Oh, how about that? Yeah, he is uh was a
grandson of the original French hugenot
immigrant Pierre Galedet and uh Peter
Wallace ended up serving in the battle
of Trenton and uh the revolutionary war
and fighting in it under Washington and
then Washington became president. He was
the personal secretary for Washington.
So yeah, how about that?
>> That's amazing.
>> It's it's special. Yeah. It's a pretty
illustrious uh uh history.
>> Not bad. Yeah. Close to a president. The
president.
>> A lot of people think about, you know,
somebody with your credentials being,
you know, a former rear admiral and they
think about UFOs and they think that
UFOs are not super serious and not maybe
worthy of the attention of somebody of
your sort of caliber. What brought them
on your radar initially?
>> Yeah. Well, two things. First, I was the
superintendent of the Naval Observatory
and I had a team of astrophysicists who
um I learned from and I it gave me this
appreciation for how big the universe
is. Every galaxy, our galaxy has a
100red billion stars which is really
beyond human comprehension and and now
we know the observable universe has
maybe over a trillion galaxies. So, it's
just and then because life's a property
of the universe, we're here and it's
very diverse. Why would it not be
elsewhere? And that's what that's what I
work on the Galileo project for Avibe
and he he usually describes the
situation like that where it would
really be extraordinary if other life
didn't exist other intelligent life that
that's what would be really anomalous.
So I was just very open-minded to that
fact that we could be visited and u by
off-world civilizations. And then of
course it kind of clinched to me when I
I was a onestar admiral and I saw on the
Navy Secret Network the Go Fast video.
What the hell are you moving here?
>> It was passed by an email dealing with
the exercise where it was filmed. The
exercise was going on off the US East
Coast. Ryan Graves was one of the pilots
flying off the USS Theodore Roosevelt.
And I received an email about about
these UAP attached was uh the go fast
video and and there was a real concern
because this is a training exercise
where all the pilots have to get
certified to land on the aircraft
carrier and that you can't deploy
overseas unless those things are done
along with other things. And so this
very compressed high pressure and they
were the email mentioned that that that
they were considering shutting down the
exercise after what happened is Ryan
talks about this. There was a section of
F-18s flying doing some training mission
and that's when one of those weird
cubinous sphere UAPs split the section.
There were two aircraft from my squadron
VFA11
and we flew or excuse me they flew took
off as a flight of two. Uh that means
they're essentially flying in a
formation like this. Um, and as they hit
the area, one of these objects went
right between the aircraft.
>> If you're not an aviator, it's hard to
appreciate how dangerous that is. You
want nothing close to you if you're in,
you know, two aircraft flying in
formation very close. And nothing should
be within miles. You know, you you would
want to have anticipation of anything in
the air in the airspace being, you know,
miles away. And then when all of a
sudden the pop-up UFO splits the
section, everyone went crazy. And that's
why the two star sent that email to
everybody. And and of course that I I
knew right there we don't test advanced
tech in training ranges during during a
very compressed training exercise. Uh
and and we have we have instrumented
test ranges for that and I knew all of
our adversary uh tech and threats uh
because I had top secret SCI clearance
and I so I knew that wasn't ours either.
Every now and then we'll have like
Chinese twers with sigant gear spying on
our exercise the exercises. There's
there's nothing like foreign there. So,
it was clearly not foreign. And I knew
right there that was that was the day
everything changed for me and and it was
just well something you'll just never
forget when your whole paradigm just
totally changes in one day.
>> Wow. And so so you received an email and
then the the email was deleted. So this
is interesting and Jay Stratton has
since confirmed it because I believe he
was somewhere in the naval intelligence
community and he and either the
predecessor of or I forgot exactly when
he stood up the UAP task force but what
the story he told me what happened is
when it was deleted they were still not
sure whether it was adversary tech or or
off-world
anomalous. So that that's why they
delete it from everybody's computer
because adversary tech, foreign military
uh capabilities are always very highly
classified. We don't want we keep that
at TS or higher because we don't want
them to know we know and we don't want
them to know how we know what we know.
And I've been involved with all many
programs like that, especially undersea
programs and and those will never see
the light of day. That that's just that
and that's that relates to this whole
UAP overclassification thing. But uh
yeah and then and so and I knew this too
cuz I've seen there's a protocol what
happens when you it's it's called
spillage I believe where if you release
uh information at at a certain
classification level and you you release
it at a lower classification level
network uh you have to basically clean
it up and there's there's a whole
protocol to do the cleanup and I I
realized when the email was deleted
that's what occurred and I I thought oh
this this must be TS or higher
>> and uh this this knowledge of these UAP
and and that's why I just never said
anything about it until I left the
government.
>> Wow. Fascinating. So, yeah, that must
have spooked you, the fact that he got
an email about a UFO and then the email
was deleted. Yeah.
>> And then you kind of So, you find out
later through Jay Stratton who's um he
ran the UAP task force and is I believe
former office of naval intelligence. Is
that right?
>> Yeah. He he's worked in a number of
intelligence capacities and and so he
yeah he wor and we worked in the same
circles and knew the same senior naval
intelligence professionals
>> and then the the interesting thing about
goast is that's probably one of the more
so there are three videos that came out
kind of alongside the 2017 New York
Times article with Leslie Kaine and you
have Go Fast, Nimmits and Gimbal and Go
Fast is kind of one of the most
controversial of of those three. Is that
right? Because there are people in Arrow
that say it's just parallax which is
essentially movement of the fleer pod
like of the tracking system. Like
typical parallax would be you put you
know finger in front of both your your
eyes and then you close one eye you open
the other eye it looks like the your
finger is moving but it's staying in the
same place. Is that do you think that
that's not the case then it's definitely
not paralyzed?
>> So it wasn't going very fast. That
that's true. They called the go I don't
know how I got the name go fast. I don't
dispute that, you know, because yeah,
that that the the angle of where it's
looking at the object and and it appears
to go fast because of the water
underneath it, but it was high above the
water and that's why it looks like that.
I don't dispute that. What I dispute is
the fact that this was a spherical
object that had no flight control
services or means propulsion traveling
in in a in an intelligently controlled
manner and and it was in formation. By
the way, there was four. I believe there
was four.
>> So that that's the context no one talks
about. That's why after my hearing,
uh, John Kazowski made some statements
about that during his hearing, inferring
that it wasn't very anomalous because it
wasn't going very fast.
>> To go fast looks like an object flying
very fast over the water, very close to
the water. A trick of the eye called
parallax makes it look like the object
is moving much faster.
>> He didn't cite the other instances, the
observations. I just I just stated that
that and by the way the context also was
that Ryan was out there. They were
seeing dozens of these things
>> and you can hear the pilots on the
gimbal for example and the go fast. So
here here's another thing. Why did I
don't want to disparage John because I
think Arrow is moving in a new direction
now. But but why didn't they acknowledge
the fact with the pilots went crazy the
audio of the Go Fast video. You hear
them. They're trying to lock it in and
they lock it in. They go got it. You you
you've heard it all.
>> Yeah. Whoa. Yeah. I mean, they're in the
airspace. They know what's normal and
they're clearly excited cuz this thing
is not normal.
>> Well, that's always my question is like
unless the guy's acting, it's like that
feels like a rational reaction to
something anomalous.
>> Yes. And then and Ryan flew with these
guys. He he knows the guy whose voice is
it is,
>> you know, they flew together as squadron
mates and and clearly this was a buzz in
the squadron. They all knew these things
were out there. They had no explanation.
None of the intel officers on on the
carrier. The carrier has a whole intel
team. They didn't know what the heck
these were. Yep.
>> So, anybody who tries to dispute the Go
Fast video is is is trying to
>> skew the conversation.
>> It'd be great if that guy at some point
came out. Um because with Nimmits, you
have all this, you have people, and then
you also have fear. Yeah.
>> So, just today as we record, the
>> principal direct deputy director of of
the off in of national intelligence,
okay, Aaron Lucas just sent out a memo
>> per the president's directive saying
that if anybody has information
regarding UAP and they had to sign an
NDA that the NDAs will be waved and they
can come out and make reports to the
pursue team in the department of war or
uh um or arrow. So that's that's
significant. And so these pilots, they
they pro I don't know if they had to
sign NDAs, but now just that directive
right there is every day something is
happening where the stigma is just being
destroyed and and those pilots might
want to come out. The only reason
they're doing it because they don't want
it to potentially harm their career, but
those days are are nearly over. Seems
like it. Yeah. If anything, it seems
like a career boost. It's like all these
opportunities to like get involved in
kind of avantguard research and you know
academic institutions and you know I I
don't I think those days are over
hopefully.
>> Well, if you're a career naval aviator
maybe not that that's
>> sure
>> but uh but again it's starting to get
acknowledged at the president's level
and and the secretary of defense with
the pursue files. So who knows that
might change entirely.
>> Yeah. And then it does feel like certain
whistleblowers are not treated well.
people like David Grush and you know um
Dylan Borland and Matthew Brown. Some of
these guys don't seem like they're uh
treated well after the fact.
>> Well, this so there is a large part of
the IC that's entrenched, you know, and
they're still either part of the legacy
program or at least the fact it still
exists that much of this information is
remains classified and they don't want
to see classified information um
revealed. Uh which is fair. Some of it
might involve our own collection
capabilities. We don't want that out
there. Yeah. But it it's uh it's it's
wrong that any of those whistleblowers
have to be uh um treated or or treated
poorly or um or harmed even
professionally.
>> Yeah, I agree. I think onlogical truth
is different than a trade secret that
can confer a tactical advantage. All I
try to do on the show is cover
ontological truth. And I think same
with, you know, anybody coming out
saying like this fundamental thing that
people should should know about because
it deals with metaphysics and physics
and things that should be taught in
academia like no one should
>> the nature of reality.
>> It's the nature of reality. Yeah. I I'm
with you. I'm glad you said that because
that Yeah. And it's it's unfortunate how
toxic some of this has become because
there's different individuals in this
space have different agendas and it has
created divisions and so many people
question other people and and just for
the record that that is the only reason
I'm in this game. I don't make any money
from this. I don't get any advantage. I
just want the truth. I've been given
through my credentials a voice and I and
that my voice is like yours. I want I
just want to uh promote the truth.
That's amazing. Yeah. No, it's it's a
tough topic. There's a lot of
infighting, a lot of interpersonal
dynamics. You'd think that it should be
us against the world and it's you know,
often kind of us against us and
>> human nature.
>> Yeah. It's unfortunate. It's um you
know, I think a rising tide raises all
ships and you know just
>> there you go. I like your nautical
terminology. Yes, sir.
>> Yeah. Exactly. No pun intended.
>> It's true though. I I I totally agree. I
wanted to take a step back and talk
about almost the intellectual firmament
for even thinking that there might be
non-human intelligence uh in our waters.
And there are some great books uh you
know Ivan Sanderson you know invisible
residents and there's a whole history of
experiences you have obviously Richard
Dolan has written a whole history of you
know USOS
>> great book yeah
>> unidentified submersible
>> Navy ships in that book Navy ship
reporting them yeah
>> can you set the scene for a person who
just thinks about UFOs as coming from
space and they have no idea about this
kind of waterbornne history of of UFOs
and US Right. And and so it's
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episode. So, it's interesting because
right now we don't our understanding of
physics and certainly an engineering
traveling light years to other uh
galaxies is something that just is not
possible with what we know. So, that's
out there. And then the other thing is
that our our earth is old enough to have
had a civilization
evolve uh and then uh have it if it were
to maybe want to avoid any kind of
cataclysms like asteroids and and um uh
impacting the earth or or and all the
all the just the terrible weather and
tsunamis and things that could destroy
civilizations. the it the the length of
time of our our our earth I guess being
existence could could it's foreseeable
and this is called the salarian
hypothesis you know it where uh some
these civilizations could have gone
under the ocean and and moved their
entire infrastructure or even within
mountain ranges in the US probably less
likely but and then have the geological
record basically destroy any evidence of
their existence and have them still be
resident somewhere, right? That that's
possible in terms of the time frame.
>> Yeah.
>> So, think about we're four billion years
in existence. So, what what if an
advanced civilization evolved after a
billion years? It's is very possible.
So, that's why that that kind of lends
credibility to the hypothesis that
possibly these UAP come from under the
oceans. But what's more interesting is
the data. So, Richard Dolan anecdotally
shares all these reports of UFOs, UFOs
coming out and going into the water. And
um it turns out uh I'm privy to a very
interesting piece of communications and
I've said I've talked around this once
on one show previously and this is the
first time I'll really go into it mostly
because I feel empowered by that new
PDNI
uh memo about UAP information. Okay,
that the whole intent is we don't want
to withhold any of this information from
the president. Okay, well let's talk
about this this email. I have a friend
who worked in the military and he was
deployed to a joint task force overseas
and so joint meaning there was different
services in there and there was a it was
a intelligence officer from another
service. So he was the J2 in the task
force and one night he pulled my friend
into their building and um and they have
a had a skiff and he showed him two
things. One was a video and it was
attached to an email and the like me in
the go fast a very similar situation.
The the video he saw was I think from an
infrared sensor. It was uh fairly low
low and it was over the ocean and it was
observing this teardropshaped looking
UAP that might have been 20 ft
lengthwise or so and it was traveling
under the ocean water and and we could
see it clearly under the water moving
along waves over the top of the surface
and as and then it at one point it
surfaces out of the water and there's no
disturbance of the water. It surfaces
out, keeps going, and then it stopped to
hover and it it seemed to behave like it
knew it was being observed. And after a
few moments, it just went vertical all
the way up beyond any sight basically of
the sensor. Sensor couldn't even track
it. Um, and it looked like it was being
lifted like like gravity in reverse, you
know, like an inverted fall. It moves so
fast. And the the intelligence guy
looked at my friend and said, "How does
that thing fly?" Uh my friend had an
engineering degree and that's why the
guy asked him this question, the intel
officer, the J2, and he said, "I I I
just don't know. Let me think about
that." He goes, "Yeah, well, think about
that. Why don't you sit back here at the
terminal? I got to go pack because I'm
leaving." He was redeploying after the
next day. And uh and so he let him look
at the whole length of the email. And
here here's what this email said. It was
from a commander, a female commander in
naval intelligence. And it was to this
long distro of couple hundred people,
hundred people maybe, you know, nearly
that many. And um my friend was very
perplexed at this because the normally
in the US military, your email domains
are, you know, my name then at and for
us.nav.mmill
or same with army or whatever. And then
then there's OSD is usually just at um I
think it's like mail.m mill. So I know
all these domains. He looked at all
these domains on these email addresses
and he didn't recognize any of them. And
they were not only they weren't just
three like us. There were four and and
they were and they're all xed out.
xxx.x.x.
And he was first he was just looked at
that and thought, "What the hell is this
program?" because he was on some system
that had a color background that he'd
never seen before. And I don't know if
you're probably not aware of this, but
when you are on a network uh and you're
you're on a workstation, you can
sometimes transfer between
classification levels. Uh you just
change the input to the screen. And so
on class systems, usually have a big
green banner. Uh top secret, no, secret
is red, top secret is yellow. And this
thing had some weird colors you've never
seen before. So, so he knew this must
have been some compartmental program or
whatever that I mean that's that's his
only and then these agencies whatever
they were he didn't know where where
these people were from. Uh it just
didn't but so that struck him as
strange. So and the the attachments that
that crazy UAP and then this female
commander goes and says basically you
know she refers to the attachment and
she makes the following statements. She
says we've been tracking these for some
time. and we still don't know their
origin or intention. Uh, and we we want
to get you up to speed on this because
right now, uh, all the agencies that
have access or have this information,
everyone's kind of keeping it to
themselves because they think it might
be part of some some SAP, special access
program, and they they're afraid that
sharing it might might remove their
ability to continue to have access of
the information. So, that that's happens
in the government all the time, the
stove piping of people wanting to
protect their own rice bowls. So she
made this statement that we needed to do
more collaboration on to find out what
these are. Okay. And that I'm sending
this email to all you our partners to uh
um encourage data data sharing and and
more discovery. And then and then she
said
these objects all the we see them in the
ocean more than more than elsewhere
coming in and out of the ocean and they
seem to be occurring in five to seven
areas of the world. um with more
frequency than than others. Okay. Um
that that's that's the gist of the
information. So a while back you might
have heard Tim Burchett make this claim.
Yeah. Someone came to me and there's
five to seven alien bases, right?
Undersea alien bases.
>> We have a higher propensity of sightings
around these five or six I believe deep
area deep water areas.
>> Now when he said that I thought I've
never heard this. I was the
oceanographer for the Navy. This this is
this is probably a stretch. Um and I
what I think happened is someone who'd
seen that email is the one who talked to
Burchett.
>> Whoa.
>> So the woman did not say they were
undersea alien bases. She just said we
see them coming in and out of the water
a lot and they're usually in five to
seven areas of the world like with with
consistency.
>> Yeah.
>> So that that's that's knowledge right
now that hasn't been put together in
terms of two plus two with a lot of
these Congress people. you know, they'll
make these big claims and it's just
really hard to know what the source is
and where it's coming from. So, this is
really that's good to know that that
might be the source.
>> Yeah. And you can see that that that
that was a very privileged email and
that's why that source did probably
didn't want to be named, but he but he
felt but he felt like so many people
have done to me. He felt, well, okay,
this congressman's he's a champion for
this. I'm going to at least tell him and
let make sure he knows. M so I I think
you know when you put those two together
and then then the third line of okay
UAPs in the ocean that you asked me
about. I've had several submarine
officers come to me two uh and one
listed and they all reported to me these
instances where they were all of a
sudden en encountering an object under a
water that was closing rapidly more
rapid than normal
other and adversary submarines. you
know, had signatures of a torpedo
closing rapidly, constant bearing,
decreasing range. Three people all had
this and the subs did an emergency deep
maneuver where they just all of a
sudden, okay, we this is what you train
to do if an adversary torpedo is inbound
and and then in each case whatever the
object was, it slowed and it went behind
them uh to kind of get out of there.
It's called going into your baffles
where you can't your sonar can't see it.
So they actually purposely evaded and
then then left the area.
>> And torpedoes can't do that.
>> No, they have a very strict profile.
It's basically close as rapidly as you
can to eliminate the the target.
>> Uh so that's not Yeah, it's not we don't
have technology that does that. And so
and all three of those folks and then I
even had another guy tell me he had a
similar encounter. or he was an acoustic
specialist, retired as a captain, was on
one of the Navy's acoustic intelligence
ships off Japan. In two cases, they also
observed these anomalous objects and all
of them called me uh because they after
my testimony to say, "Hey, I want you to
know that there's there's some there
there." And
>> and these are very credible people.
>> That's amazing. Yeah. I mean, you have
Alexander Wiggins we can talk about
because he's sort of on record.
>> Uh he's an example of Well, I'm proud of
that actually because he he he came out
because because of me. He saw that I
testified.
>> He he looked me up and sent me a note
and we got on the phone and talked
>> and and I encouraged him to
engage the hill and now you see he
testified.
>> And what what was his case exactly?
>> Well, I'm pretty sure, forgive me if I
screw this up, but I think he was on the
bridge of the Omaha when that that one
object spherical object goes into the
water.
>> Mhm. off Southern California in 2019.
>> A self-luminous tic-tac-shaped object
emerged from the ocean before linking up
with three other sim similar objects.
The four then disappeared simultaneously
with a high synchronized near
instantaneous acceleration.
>> And then he shared with me video of when
he was on the USS Jackson, same region,
and and they were seeing multiple
erratic moving UAP at night. Uh and I
mean and he told me this. He said, "We
see these things so often out there that
we're desensitized to it."
>> I believe that. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they
call it the silent service for a reason,
you know, and so a lot of people see a
lot of things and then they they sort of
keep keep quiet.
>> Well, well, so this is Alejandra wasn't
he was not a submariner.
>> Okay.
>> Or Alex. Uh he but he was on these
surface ships. Um but they Yeah. The
submarine service is called the
>> They call that the sun. Okay. Got it.
Okay. Got it. But ultimately, so that
what I I think it's a good thing to
point out that
>> Alex, you know, he's he testified
eventually because he was encouraged by
people like me
>> and that this is good. So now he
testifies and other senators are going
to come forward and and you see this is
a movement. It's it's not slowing down.
>> Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah. Hope
hopefully it kind of snowballs and we
get some official statements made and
you know, so it's occurring.
>> We kind of cross the Rubicon. Um, in in
2013, I believe in Auadilla, you have
this uh in Puerto Rico, you have this
uh, you know, 3inute video of a trans
medium object, an object that seems to
descend into the Atlantic Ocean and then
come out as well.
>> Yeah. And of course, all the debunkers
have tried to do just that on the video.
Ultimately, just like all the pursuit
files, yeah, we need more data. We need
other sensors to corroborate that. But
it appears to be another example of
transmedium UAP uh encounter and and so
yeah and I think that's what we want to
do in the UAP science advisory council
that I'm on now that reports to the ODNI
is we want to analyze these videos and
data more to get a better grip on their
their actual velocities and movements
and trajectories and uh and understand
better how they do what they do what
what they are
>> and then ultimately what their intention
is. One of my favorite cases is uh Nova
Scotia 1960 because often with a lot of
these, you know, unidentified
submersible objects, it's just the
object. In this case, it involves
occupants, possible pilots, maybe
non-human intelligence sort of driving
or steering and then I think repairing
the object.
>> That's right. That's right. Yeah. So,
this is a in a book by an author named
Chris Styles who went and researched
these Royal Canadian Navy divers and and
and it was all in the aftermath of an
exercise, a mind sweeping exercise
called Sweep Clear Five and that's the
title of the book and and he he
investigates all this and evidently and
there were sightings of UAP going into
the water at night and then and then
these divers claimed uh that they saw
UFO fo occupants outside these two
saucers on the on the seabed and and and
that they even took video of it
>> and so interesting. I I'm going to make
a couple plugs. There's this one
researcher in Canada who contacted me
recently and he's he's investigating
that. He's doing foyas or the equivalent
in Canada to try to get that video
basically. His name is Brian Fitzpatrick
and um I'm going to do a quick we can go
down this this rabbit hole later, but
the reason he he he first started
investigating cattle mutilations and we
let's talk about that later, but but he
has a book called The Operator,
>> okay?
>> And it's it's an astonishing book. I
it's the I think it's the biggest reveal
about cattle mutilations out there. And
so he's a real diligent researcher. He
used to be he was a 20-year homicide
cop. And so he knows the he understands
the forensics of these kind of things.
But ultimately Brian is researching this
whole topic of the Nova Scotia UAPs. And
again, it's it's a you read the book and
there seems to be evidence, not hard
evidence, but eyewitness testimony of
these UAP in the water and like you
said, occupants. It's amazing.
>> You think about a movie like The Abyss,
you know, and
>> it's Yeah. It's the abyss in reality,
right?
>> Yeah. I wonder how much and I I believe
it it was like it they didn't use
non-human intelligence but it was very
similar.
>> It was Yeah. What was the name of it? Uh
>> non-aterrestrial intelligences. That was
it.
>> And it was these kind of like luminous
objects in the deep sea and they would
sort of and you got to wonder, you know,
with with people like Spielberg and
James Cameron, like are they getting
little, you know, whispers in their ear
from, you know, real sources?
>> Right. Right. And uh and in fact um
there's a Reddit thread out there and I
don't know what to make of it, but let's
just start everything's starting to add
up and and I think this guy's name is
Condor Man.
>> Okay.
>> And he went to he made a big statement
and this is Reddit. Okay. I'm not I'm
beyond of what I know actually. Sure.
Sure. But as we start lining things,
ducks in a row. Okay. Another duck in a
row is this guy who's who's made
statements that those five to seven
places where of the world's oceans where
we see UAP coming in and out of the
water, uh that um that they are
locations where they reside, NHI's, and
they're they manufacture their own UAPs.
Every time they they come out,
everyone's a new one. And he had some
other wild statements. I'm not going to
go into them here, but every now and
then, I'm finding more and more about
the ocean connection. This was a I
believe um a 4chan whistleblower. Oh,
was it? Yeah. He claimed to work on the
program. That was it. That was it.
>> He said that basically he implied that
every time you mention Lazar, you get in
trouble because he was this sort of, you
know, leaker of, you know, real stuff
from the program and that these objects
are made in mobile construction units.
>> So, you have things going around under
the ocean and then they're made for
purpose. So, they're made to spec
in order to carry different payloads
possibly. And it's just I mean I I know
you for clarity, you're just relaying
what you saw. I can't endorsing it, but
I think it's fascinating.
>> That is so interesting. Well, yeah. And
as I said, I only start going down this
now because of that email I mentioned,
which I I know my source is credible
>> and uh and so I I'll I'll definitely
swear to that. Mhm.
>> But then as you traje that forward.
Yeah. Who knows? Uh anyways, well there
have to be, you know, Yeah. because I
think the Bett thing where he's walking
around, he's getting interviewed by some
TMZ person and he goes, "Yeah, there are
five, you know, spots where these things
seem to show up more more than not that
gets translated on Twitter to like alien
bases." Yeah.
>> So, but I do think they're hot spots.
And you we mentioned, you know, off the
coast of Japan, I uh just recently
interviewed the defense minister there,
former defense minister and Hamadan.
>> Yeah. I I might have been at at uh I
know that I gave a virtual presentation
to this UAP caucus in the parliament or
diet
>> in Japan. Yeah. A year or two ago. And
then just recently I was interviewed in
a Japanese um media outlet called the
Liberty.
>> Oh, cool. And and you know now the prime
minister of office is setting up a UAP
investigation unit. So that Japan's
Yeah. There's a lot lot of changes
recently.
>> Oh yeah. They're very kind of uh
forwardlooking on the whole topic and
the
>> How did that go? How'd that go?
>> Oh, it was amazing. It was really cool.
It was such an honor to be there and
such a beautiful experience. Were you in
Japan? I was in Japan. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
>> I love that country. I live there.
>> Did you?
>> I was on Not much. I was on a ship that
was at sea a lot, but we were stationed
in Japan.
>> Oh wow. Okinawa or where?
>> Yakoska.
>> Oh, Yukoska. Okay, cool. Amazing.
>> Love that. Love the people. Love that
place.
>> It's got an incredible history when it
comes to UFOs. There's a um a mountain
called Mount Senori and it's in the
Fukushima prefrure and Fukushima, of
course, is famous for its 2011 nuclear
disaster. Um but UFOs were reported to
show up around the nuclear disaster.
>> I know. I've seen the video. Yeah. And
there's a there's a mountain with the at
at the top of the mountain there's a
museum
>> dedicated to UFOs in Senor. Yeah.
>> No. Did you go there?
>> I went and
there's also a guy and I I'll shut up
about Japan at at some point, but
there's a guy Takeno Jouen. He's a NASA
historian and he has met Edward Teller.
He's met Jesse Marcel Jr. He's
interacted with Herman Oberth, you know,
the father of German rocketry. like all
these amazing kind of gray beards and he
has these NASA uh you know rocket
boosters and capsules on loan from NASA
for a hundred years and he has a museum
dedicated to American space history and
UFOs and he claims to have
>> is it in Japan? He's in Japan. He claims
to have a piece of the Roswell crash
with that and I don't know if it did
look at it.
>> I did. It was in it was encased and I
just, you know, I was like there was
definitely a translation barrier and I
was asking about the, you know, the
extent of the testing and it to me it's,
you know, similar to what you read on
Reddit. I just can't endorse the thing.
But it was amazing.
>> Yeah, that's really neat, Jesse. Wow.
>> It was cool. Um, but okay, speaking of,
you know, alien bases or hotspots, if
you had to, you know, just pinpoint hot
spots around the world, one might be the
South China Sea. Are there are there
others that like would you if you had to
if you had to pick like five to seven
top candidates? What would what would
they be for you as far as spots?
>> Sure. I'm not super knowledgeable about
this, but um there's one in the
Atlantic. I'm almost certain the Bermuda
Triangle or what have you. And then uh
and then Southern California seems to be
the Catalina Channel seems to be a hot
spot.
>> Yeah,
>> that's just from my my own I would say
less than educated knowledge. I don't
I'm not a dedicated UAP researcher, but
I'm starting to be one, if you will.
>> What What do you What do you say?
>> Well, yeah. I mean, Preston Denn wrote a
book called Undersea UFO based.
>> I've read it. I read it. See, that
that's where unfortunately you get into
total speculation. Not again, not not to
hammer him. It's an informative book
because all those eyewitness accounts
are are serious. These are people who
saw things. But at the end of the book,
I I find some fault with what he did. He
he went and there's this whole line of
on social media somewhere about this
feature off of SoCal called Sycamore
Null.
>> Yeah. Point Doom off the coast of
>> That's right. and he he puts it in his
book and ultimately that that that area
has been so thoroughly researched. There
was even a peer-reviewed marine geology
publication on that on and and it was
surveyed extensively and there's the
geologists all come up with various
theories about how it was formed. But
that that that what he when he
speculates that's the undersea base,
he's totally off the mark. It's been so
thoroughly surveyed there's
>> it's it's just not. I mean it was sub
also subbottom profilers that go under
the seafloor to look at the geological
structure. There was no alien base
there.
>> Yeah because I occasionally surf at
point doom and I you know I had some
friends who I actually I believe a
mutual friend you know Will O'Brien at
Ulyses.
>> Yeah that's right.
>> So I was like Will we got to get your
rover and you know put it down there and
let's see. And we did a little bit of
preliminary research and but for the
context for the audience this is
somebody with a startup who builds these
amazing deep sea rovers and uh we did
the research and we're like I don't
think there's anything it's not even
worth the resources to like look
>> it wouldn't have been
>> unfortunately but still holding out hope
maybe for Catalina.
>> Well hey look at this I have uh right
>> and so this is how common this is
becoming. So my my my middle daughter is
at the Naval Academy. She's a
midshipman. I'm very proud of her.
Congrats.
>> Thank you. And and she's studying
oceanography just like her parents. And
uh and her she swims on the swim team
like her parents and uh and so it's fun
to see. But her teammate uh her teammate
has a father who is just retired as a
F18 pilot, formerly F-14 pilot, so Navy
captain. and they live in Pacific
Palisades and and they've seen they've
seen UAP over the channel litted in
formation several like white lights
clearly operating under intelligent
control. Uh I mean and it was funny
because when we first met he'd known
that I speak up about this and the
family shared with me, oh yeah, we see
these things.
>> Yeah, there are a lot of reports around
Catalina. I'm I'm a big fan of this sort
of mid-century
uh inventor named Thomas Townsen Brown
and he had a UFO experience on Catalina
Island. What happened?
>> He was being approached. This is, by the
way, his daughter relaying this. Um, he
he passed away in 1985. Um, but he was
being approached by this orb.
>> Yes. And I know the exact spot. It
approached him.
It actually approached him. And he said
that he learned
so much standing there with that ball of
light. And he said he went to work
immediately and he worked. That was that
was the beginning of his legacy.
>> And I guess he then sort of approached
the orb and they had this like almost
like communion moment with this sort of
glowing orb. And according to his
daughter, that was when he downloaded
his life's work and he had a lab in
Pasadena at the time
>> and he he went back to the lab and he
just, you know, really started working
on this. He was actually became a Navy
man after that. You know, this is
interesting because now I'm on this UAP
science advisory council reporting to OD
and I
>> and we're starting to dig into all these
pursue files and there's this one report
that came out about these law
enforcement
>> agents that are at a national security
site somewhere uh in the west and they
have all these interactions with orbs
and one's even a mother ship of orbs
that launches other orbs from it. And
and this is uh and this is something
actually that uh Avi Lo, our chair,
wrote about in one of his medium
articles because this these are
legitimate witnesses. And then then John
Kazowski for the record stating that a
large percent of these orbs just have no
explanation. There's nothing that we
have that we that we could it's not
weather. It's not some technology. It's
not some laser effect. They're they're
they're seriously just not sure what
these are. So that that's he so we're
starting to look at ways to describe how
do you produce these orbs? What are
they? And we're starting to to research
these because they're seen all
everywhere all the time
>> just and yeah. So that's that's a a
serious line of investigation. I'm going
to go under this as a member of this
council to go meet with uh two engineers
at um uh off the coast. They've been
researching off the coast of Long
Island. M Jerry and John Tedesco.
>> Oh yeah. You know the Tedesco brothers.
>> Yeah. They have some serious data of
orbs off offshore. Some going into the
water and and so now this is a
legitimate line of research for us.
>> So I'm I'm going to go up there. We're
actually I'm not going to go there.
We're going to go to Maine and that's
just the location we're going to meet.
I'm going to review their data and
hopefully hopefully share that with the
rest of the council and and and start
doing a little more a little more. I
mean, their council has a number of
different types of psychologists,
engineers, physicists, oceanographers
like me. So, we're going to go all go
after this and see uh if we can get
improve our understanding what these are
actually.
>> That's amazing. Well, they were a big
part of tracking the jersey drone flap.
>> Um in 2024,
>> Trump made a really interesting, you
know, as Trump tends to do, kind of
sheets from the hip. And after that
Jersey drone flap, he was like, "Uh, we
know where they're coming from. They're
coming from a garage."
>> Look,
our military knows where they took off
from. If it's a garage, they can go
right into that garage. They know where
it came from and where it went.
Something strange is going on. For some
reason, they don't want to tell the
people.
>> And it seemed to be implying that, you
know, he thinks that they're coming from
underwater. And there were sightings of
course around that time off the coast
where it seemed like these UAPs were
emerging from the water. So I yeah I
don't know I actually that's a big
question mark for me the Jersey drones.
I don't know their nature. I have a good
friend named Greg Scaduto who now works
with Ryan Graves at Americans for Safe
Aerospace and he wrote a terrific
article. It got published in the Rolling
Stone about the New Jersey drones. I
encourage your listeners to check it
out. And uh but still it's just still a
a real unknown there in terms of at
multiple levels, local, state, even
federal. Trump Yeah. He made the claim,
but he didn't really back it up with any
evidence or any further elaboration. So
I'm not sure what to make of it.
>> Yeah. Um you are looking for Atlantis
maybe.
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Now, back to today's show. You are
looking for Atlantis, maybe?
Yeah. Uh, okay. I I I'm on an NDA for
this. I can't say a whole lot more, but
I'm with a team of very esteemed
archaeologists and geologists that uh we
believe we found the a region in the u
Atlantic that is uh fits all the
descriptions of Plato's d in Plato's
dialogues where he talks about Atlantis
at length with actual dimensions of the
width of the canal and system and uh
other features of it that I won't go
into because I don't want the location
revealed. field, but we we believe we
found a an area we have some proprietary
bethimemetry uh and we it's very high
resolution and the region that um he
points to basically there are a lot of
features there that that correspond to
exactly how Plato described it.
>> Wow.
>> So we uh we're in the just today I had
the most amazing development. I can't
say who, but a very very well-funded
researcher with uh a very high-end ship
and a remotely operated vehicle is in
wants to take our wants to take the
brief. He wants to hear
>> Wow.
>> Yeah. And this happened today and I'm
thrilled because this guy could make it
make this expedition happen this summer.
>> That is so exciting.
>> I know. I know. I mean, I'm praying
because we we we he's got a ship and he
could and this ship does he's he owns
it. He could do whatever he wants with
it and if he really feels the need we we
might be diving on that thing real soon.
>> That's amazing, man. Well, if you need a
water boy, let me know.
>> Right. Uh well, anyways, I Yeah, I'm
going to more to follow.
>> Very very cool. Can I speculate and can
you you don't have to say anything as to
where this thing might be? Well, let let
me just I think this whole thing topic
of Atlantis is a lot like UAP where uh
it's just sort of gotten very um
conflated with all these other theories
and whatnot. And I think when you just
walk it back uh to the time frame he
alludes to there, it's not impossible at
all. and and and then then we come up
with the geologic theory to explain
rapid geological substance over over a
period of of just a few years rather
than millennia that could cause a a
whole city to submerge like a island,
right? So there's there's all the all
the physics and all the all the human
history. We're not talking a million
years ago or a billion. We're talking
within the span of of human civilization
before Egypt. But
>> yeah.
>> Yeah. Well, pre the9s,
uh, you know, if anyone were to say that
the civilization was as old as Geekbecy
said it was, they'd think they were
crazy. It's the history of archaeology
is the history of things getting older.
And it's like Mo's law or something
where the number of transistors on a
chip. It's bas literally a law you could
basically come up with because the
things that are lower in the sediment
layer are also generally older
>> and
the archaeology itself as a field is
only 200 years old with the you know
discoveries of cities of Assyria and
Babylonia 200 years ago.
>> It's fascinating, huh?
>> It is fascinating. And so I think the
idea not necessarily Atlantis is a
placeholder term that comes from you
know Solon relaying this myth to to
Plato. I think a lot of people discount
that because it was told at this mythos
festival of Tomus and Creta when in fact
you know I think a lot of Plato's stuff
was probably actually onlogically true
and real. And a good a good example of
something like this is Troy was
supposedly fictional and Hinrich von
Schlimman this kind of amateur German
businessman found it.
>> Yeah.
>> And and I like that because exactly it's
someone who's not mainstream in
archaeology who and he find this in fact
here the the person who is leading this
research effort
>> uh I again not going to name his name
but he he's a career emergency room MD.
>> Whoa. He's not he's not has nothing to
do with archaeology but he and it's a
good story uh because it takes people
who are outside the system to have a a
more you know p practical view of and
this is this occurs in all fields so he
uh because he's an ER doc uh stressful
job and so he would on weekends just
look up things that were interesting and
and he kind of got down this this
Atlantis rabbit hole and started reading
the original dialogues and doing and
just over 10 years of time compounding a
great deal of of open-source geologic
and archaeological information and then
then bringing on advisors. He's bringing
on and so this is I I'm really glad I'm
a recent adviser. I came in just because
of my oceanography experience and and
what I did um so I set him up there's
another researcher and because we I want
to keep this private I'm not going to
name him who has been researching
uh UAP and moon structures. Okay, I I
won't name him now. Uh so he comes to me
and and we we end up just sharing
information and staying in touch because
I like his approach. This is really
interesting research. He's anybody who
is approaching the these fields with a
real objective and bright mind. He's a
physicist for example and uh okay I want
to
>> he might have been on my show but
>> oh actually after when all this comes
out I'll lecture him to you. He's a neat
guy. Oh cool. Uh he's yeah he's the one
researching moon and Mars structures.
Uh,
>> he's not it's not Max Direct Shawnie.
>> It is. Oh,
>> okay. I was going to
>> Well, then if Well, then then that's
fine. I don't mind having his name out
there.
>> Yeah, he's he's been on. So, yeah. And
he's a friend. He's amazing. He's so
hard-headed.
>> Gosh, I know.
>> Very deep and and I wouldn't want to
debate him as
>> Oh my gosh. No, I'm not in his league.
But uh yeah, so it is Max and uh in fact
but so Max came up with this uh
algorithm that is is searching for um
I guess terrain and search looks at any
kind of um 3D topographical
data set and and the algorithm and
someone else developed it so I I don't
want to and I don't know who that is. I
forgot his name. But but so so just a
full disclosure there. But the algorithm
can determine with I think a high
probability what is natural and what is
humanmade or or artificial and and then
you can and so what I did is I said this
would be really good for our Atlantis
region bethimemetry. M
>> and so I I connected Max and and this
researcher and they got along and that's
and that connection eventually lead is
leading us to potentially this very
wealthy ocean researcher with a ship.
>> Wow.
>> So I find this so this is like a very
broad philosophical uh pitch here. I
never say no to anyone who reaches out
to me. I I don't I don't not answer
emails. Every now and then I get some
really strange things. I I don't answer
those. But but if there is a very
legitimate credible person who says I'm
very interested I want to contribute and
sometimes I just got to say thanks I'll
keep your name and you know when I'm
ready to to when there's something that
comes that we could use you for. But I
just it's just to me it's I don't like
being rude and I like I know the
opportunities arise when you build a
network and maintain it. And that that's
exactly what happened with Max. Okay.
I'm busy with and it was it was you know
every new person that has more
information sometimes hard to keep track
of but I knew Max had that real
intellect that I this is a guy worth
knowing and now he might make this whole
Atlantis thing a victory.
>> That's so exciting. Well, I I really
hope it happens and yeah, he's the
exactly the right mind to kind of help
with, you know, efforts like this cuz
he's he's very hard-headed and uh yeah,
really kind of lucid as a thinker. So,
>> right. There's someone else in that
category I want to bring up quickly.
Sure. And I'm not sure where this will
go, but um I happen to also not say no
and to a person who reached out to me
who is a writer and um his name is uh um
Richard Bellho and uh he's got a book
called the full extent
>> and he wrote a really thoughtful long
form article called um human to humanoid
>> and you could look up his website. uh
Richard Butel. What's interesting about
him besides just being again a deep
thinker on this topic uh is now you
might know we've gotten a lot of
traction in the media uh and so for
example I was on Brett Bear's show uh
Jake Tapper show uh Sean Ryan show yours
now.
>> There you go. And uh and so Rick is the
one who got me the Brett Bear interview.
>> And he's the one he's my been my private
uh kind of confidant in getting to to
Brett, which is big get having that and
and is I think is is really helping our
movement and and he remains interested.
Uh, so he and not only did he interview
me, he interviewed I think Carl Nell,
>> uh, may
>> David Grush,
>> David Grush, Jay Stratton, but basically
once once Rick came to me, then I ended
up vectoring Brett to all those folks
and he he got them all on. So that
that's been a big kick for us of getting
the credibility established and
mainstreaming this.
>> So I want to give Rick a shout out, too.
It's one of these shout out.
>> They're out there. Yeah.
>> Yeah. I'll say this and you you should
say nothing, but I think the Azors is
interesting. The reason I say that is
because I'm friends with Randall
Carlson.
>> Oh, yeah.
>> And he is uh probably as deep as anybody
I know when it comes to Plato and you
know the historical accuracy of like
where Atlantis would actually be
located. And so he he puts it in the
Azor. It's a very broad region. So at
least uh you know could we could we
could keep it vague but um yeah I think
I think something might be interesting
kind of
>> Randall and uh um is it Graham um
>> Graham Hancock
>> Hancock. Yeah, exactly. I like these
folks that are are not um they're
they're pushing the boundary of of of
science and history as it should be in a
legitimate way. I think so. Yeah. Like
but we're learning more and like you
said history we're walking back history
more and more. The ultraterrestrial
hypothesis is so interesting. This idea
that there was maybe a cataclysm. I mean
maybe something caused the ice age. And
that's what those two guys think is that
maybe there was a comet um air burst in
the torid meteor stream uh which occurs
twice a year every year. Uh and this
occurred literally actually if you look
at when um you know the the legend of
Atlantis was told it was like 600 BC and
it was like 9,000 years earlier is when
this occurred and that maps to meltwater
pulse 1b which is a flood that probably
got us out of the ice age. So like a
flood caused the ice age and a flood
might have gotten us out of the ice age
and both might have you know involved
sort of cataclysmic shifts in the earth.
Yeah.
>> And of course you you'd end up with a
lot of stuff really buried and all the
stuff Graham is uncovering of like you
know
>> footprints on in North America from
20,000 years ago and ancient
archaeological structures that look you
know really the same across disperate
parts of the world. I think Atlantis is
this it's become this hokey almost uh
age of Aquarius hippie like placeholder
that you know has a connotation has
baggage but the idea of there being
possibly an antidoluvian advanced
civilization I think we have to be
open-minded to that why not
>> why not in terms of our evolution of our
our our intellect there has to have been
really rich civilizations in that those
time frames totally have you heard of
the Baltic like see anomaly.
>> I have. Yes.
>> So I I went out there.
>> You did?
>> Yeah.
>> Oh, that's right. I saw that. Yes, I saw
I saw you on that. It was with uh
>> Dennis Asper. He's a treasure hunter, I
guess, historically. So there's like
this mercenary like trying to find like,
you know, often it was like liquor and
wine and these like, you know,
shipwrecks and stuff. And in the middle
of the Baltic Sea, kind of smack dab
between Sweden and Finland, he finds
this thing that looks like the
Millennium Falcon as far as the shape.
Um, and it and it like it it seems like
it's emitting all sorts of
electromagnetic anomalies.
>> Lost GPS very close to the
>> to the object.
>> Oh my god.
>> We're right above the spot right above
the Baltic Sea anomaly
>> and they send rovers down there and the
rovers go off the uh GPS failures occur
all the time. It's it's actually very
similar to Skinwalker Ranch in many
ways.
>> Oh, let's talk about that, too. Well, I
want to talk about both because the
subplot to me of the show, Secrets of
Skinwalker Ranch and basically the
Baltic Sea Anomaly is that we've located
UFOs or at least UFOs in that they're
unidentified and they have bizarre
properties. I'm not saying they're
flying objects. I'm not saying they were
formally flying. I'm just saying there's
a lot of anomalies and there are sort of
weird attributes to them.
>> Right. And you're talking about the one
in the mesa.
>> The one in the mesa. Exactly. And it's
like we've located them, but we it's
hard to actually extract them because
it's like they have a life of their own.
>> So, I'd love to get more of a a more
robust oceanographic team out to anomaly
to research it because Dennis doesn't
have infinite resources. It's hard to go
to sea and do research like you did. Uh,
and and that's so potentially like with
Atlantis, if I can get one of these
higherend well-funded oceanographic
researchers to explore that, I I'd like
to. So, I'm looking for opportunities.
But going back to the ranch, a recent
development for me and it's exciting and
interesting is that uh and it was
actually because um Brandon Fugal, the
owner, he and I are had this common I
I'll call it a difference of opinion
with the former AROW director uh Sean
Kirkpatrick. And that sort of united us
in a little in a way we started
communicating and he said and he invited
my wife and I out to the ranch. by the
way. Um I I want to talk remote viewing
because my wife has completed Paul
Smith's courses.
>> Wow.
>> And we should go there. Yeah. But uh so
which is really neat and um
>> and so we communicated and he invited us
out. So we went out and we had this
great day together. Uh and it just it
was really something that the show
doesn't necessarily highlight
purposefully, but it is so beautiful out
there. I I love the West and it's just a
great location. We didn't have anything
anomalous occur. Uh but uh but we got
the whole history and and we learned the
their scientific method which is
terrific.
>> Yeah, I'm I'm I'm fascinated by it. It's
and I don't know a lot of people, you
know, say, "Oh, it's like the modern Oak
Island or whatever." Oak Island's very
different. Okay. Like they were looking
for the Ark of the Covenant and the
whole show is them not finding the Ark
of the Covenant. Secrets of Skinwalker
Ranch, they're finding interesting stuff
on every show.
>> So it's like entirely different. It's
not like there's this one binary event,
you know, after all this buildup. It's
like an accumulation of evidence. So,
>> yeah. And and we you have to appreciate
too the history here. Recall that DIA
funded a two-year or so effort to
research the ranch. And this is the
books that Jim Latsky and Cole Keller
wrote with George Knap. Yep.
>> Then the the follow on that Jim wrote,
Future Visions and New Insights, I think
they're called. But that that he
documents fully the research done there
all the anomalies many witnesses this is
a government funded I mean actually some
people he likes to say or maybe it's him
or somebody that that that's basically
disclosure right there that those books
>> a funded effort now and and um so and
it's transition now to uh the the nature
of of the of the show right now on
History Channel but but serious real
research that Travis is leading
>> yeah definitely and a lot of those derds
that came out of that period
OAP and you know what Bigalow was doing.
>> It was a lot of really impressive
scientists who were kind of doing the
>> research. These are serious people.
Yeah. Exactly.
>> Absolutely. And it's interesting to me
that academia is so kind of you know
dismissive of a lot of these things
because
>> academia actually here's so uh I have a
book you know out here and it's uh
called holding fast and heavy seas.
>> Go buy it Amazon. It's on Amazon, Barnes
& Noble, my website, timgalet.com.
And it's about my leadership in the Navy
and then at Noah during Trump's first
term. And you know, ultimately the what
it's about is that Trump is a very
challenging executive to work for. Uh
but uh and even though we we had I dealt
with that, uh we were able to achieve at
this agency I worked at the National
Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration,
Noah, a lot of really significant
environmental wins. wins for the ocean,
for ocean technology, for weather and uh
um and that this it's just a story of
how to prevail when it can be difficult.
And so, and just like right now, okay,
the the a lot of people are have a hard
time with many of what Trump things
Trump is doing, the Iran war, what have
you. But, uh but there are things he's
also doing that are very good. And I I
there's his science adviser, Michael
Casios. I I I worked with him in during
the first term. and and and I think he's
taken a a good approach. Granted, a lot
of funding cuts everybody has a problem
with, but there's plenty of of private
sector research occurring right now. And
that's really what he's working to
embrace is all the advances in the
private sector. And and and so my point
is this that that a lot of uh the
American scientific enterprise,
mainstream science has become, and Avi
writes about this all the time,
basically gunshy. They're they're just
they refuse to innovate and use frontier
tech. They've sort of just gravitated
towards the mean. And I think I think
Avi and and Michael Crafty I think
they're right.
>> And this is what this UAP thinking is
about. This embracing the potential for
Atlantis to be and go search for it.
It's just not not being afraid willing
to think outside the box. And that that
just in terms of in terms of the way you
think and and so I think in mainstream
science they're just because they they
won't look into UAP seriously and and
and that's so that those are the things
I'm trying to change. That's what my
book's about is is working to uh address
things as as you see them for the truth
that they are. Yeah. I agree. I think I
think the kind of Overton window things
just get very narrow.
>> Exactly. at the end of a paradigm and
often things that are not taken
seriously uh end up, you know, being
becoming the mainstream in the future.
And if you can't point to anything that
isn't received knowledge that you're
not, you know, somewhat into or
interested in or think might become
received knowledge or mainstream in the
future, then you're definitely on the
wrong side of history,
>> right?
>> You have to be kind of inherently. If
you just look at the history of science
and human knowledge, there's a decay
rate on present knowledge and there's
always new knowledge coming in. So,
>> yeah,
>> I think being totally close-minded to
that is kind of dogmatic. Um, and I
agree with you.
>> Good. Yeah, exactly right. I'm glad.
Thank you. I appreciate you addressing
that.
>> The other thing I wonder is how much
kind of, you know, signatures, whether
it be radar, you know, actually move the
needle. Like I feel like we need the
threshold for evidence because you know
I just debated Michael Shurmer who's a
fellow UAP advisory council member on on
the show and um
>> it's like the threshold for evidence for
a lot of you know people to believe that
there's even a there there is really
high like you you need like cuz I
brought up like this Japan Airlines case
in 1986
I believe.
>> I know that. Yeah.
>> Where it's like you have 45 minutes of
publicly available radar data.
physicists who reviewed it like Kevin
Kuth who's also on the review panel and
he's saying that you know I think these
show you know UFOs present and you have
you have two objects and then you have a
large like almost aircraft carrier sized
walnutshaped object following this thing
and then you have this you know what
seems like a very above board pilot who
I believe he was you know military
before he became a commercial pilot for
for for decades and you know Japan
Japanese culture It's like they're not
histrionic or attention seeking at all.
>> And so, you know, you have that and you
have and then you have the Nimtt's case
where it's similar profile with David
Fraver and you have Fleer alongside it.
>> So, like say you get the radar for
Nimmits like at what what point do we
just admit that there's a there there. I
mean, you then you get optical on top of
that. Like I I'm I'm not I'm still
guessing some subset of the population
if we had optical radar and fleer, you
know, in a specific instance with a high
credibility witness, they would still be
holding out. Yeah, that seems to be
Well, remember this this whole
stigmatization has been an 80-year
campaign and it's been very effective
and wellunded. It started after the
Robertson panel and we all So, this is
it's just that's why it's so hard to
break.
No one's it's not open yet, but it's
becoming open. And I think the I really
think uh well, there's two things. The
more the public has to be accepting and
that's occurring. And then I think it's
important for authoritative sources to
acknowledge this reality and that might
be what is occurring um with our
government right now. It's again, it's
still it's a work in progress with the
pursue files. Again, there's no metadata
there, but there's a whole lot of UAP
activity in those videos and reports. So
we I think that's what it's going to
take. I think it's going to take uh our
government because we all we do show
leadership in many areas still we still
do. Uh it's going to it like I'm doing
with a science advisory count council
with ODNI. It's it's got to be the the
the White House saying okay there we
here's what we have. Well, speaking of
um kind of people who are more
open-minded and adventurous, I think I
read somewhere that you might be working
with Victor Visco on the Atlantis front
or
>> he's a good friend of mine.
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. So, I I got I met him through my
work at Noah and and so we signed an
agreement together. We were at a Capitol
Hill event uh and I introduced him and
that's how we started our relationship.
And the agreement we had was he had
built this submersible that could go to
the full ocean depth, deepest part of
the ocean, the Challenger Deep in the
Mariana's Trench. And uh he and he
bought a ship, a former Navy ship that
became a Noah ship and now was his ship
called the pressure drop. And then uh
his submersible is called the limiting
factor. And he dived to five in 2018 and
19. He dived to the five deepest
trenches all around the world. No one
had ever done it. And he called this the
five deeps. And then he did the deepest
one, Challenger deep, 14 times or so.
And so what we did at Noah is we put a
scientist on a ship to help him
accurately map all those trenches
because none of them had been have been
mapped to modern standards and and fully
so so he could say this is the deepest
part of that trench and then go dive in
it.
>> Some of the trenches that he dived in,
we weren't sure what was the deepest
part.
>> And so our scientists helped him with
that. he shared his data with us because
we're we're the um curator of of ba
baometric data for the US ees. So we
have this relationship now and uh and
yeah he got there because as a member of
the explorers club like me and he had uh
um he he started out mountain climbing
and he climbed Kilimanjaro and he failed
the first time and he that stealed his
resolve and he succeeded the next time
and then he decided to climb all the
highest peaks in the continents. He I
think he climbed the five
>> and then he skied to the North Pole and
the South Pole.
>> So yes, and so that's called the
Explorer's Grand Slam.
>> So he did all that and then
>> and he went to space
>> origin. So that was So there you go.
Then then he did this because that
wasn't enough for him. He did all those
five dives and then then he went into
space. Yeah,
>> that's nuts.
>> So he's the most vertical human on the
planet.
>> Sounds like it sounds like the real life
Doseki guy or something. most
interesting man in the world. is he is
100% that you know and what's cool is
that first of all he's very humble guy
was a Navy intelligence officer
>> uh and um and retired as a commander
>> and so uh one of my favorite uh pictures
in the book is uh the first person to
dive into the the Mariana's trench that
Challenger deep part deep seven 35,000
feet so it's seven miles deep
>> was a guy named Don Walsh with a Swiss
oceanographer named Jean Peard in 1960
>> with a US Navy ba uh bath escape they
called it
>> and uh can't believe they made it just
unbelievable expedition so and no one
did it after except for James Cameron
once uh and his his his submersible
almost didn't make it and then so and so
Victor followed them but Victor did
everything right he engineered it
perfectly he even pressure tested it and
the only tank that can do a full ocean
depth simulation it's in Russia And uh
and so anyways, so Victor goes and does
that, breaks Don Walsh's record and and
and then in 20 22 maybe there was a 90th
birthday party for Don Walsh. And so
Victor came and I I came to uh celebrate
him or and um and so we got this picture
together. Uh Don Walsh on one side,
retired Navy captain who would dive the
deepest dive until then. the person who
broke it, Victor Visco, retired Navy
commander, and then me in the middle,
retired Navy admiral. Uh, and we're
holding at the Explorers Club, the a
Navy flag that that Victor signed and
took with him and to that deepest dive
in the Mariana's Trench. So, he he
actually flew it outside the pressure
hall, so it got a little wet and has a
little rust on it. But, so I have this
Navy flag. He gave it to me, too. and he
it's hanging in my uh my family room and
it's uh they know it's been to the
deepest part of the ocean.
>> That's special.
>> Yeah, it is so cool. And and that V and
that that that picture of all of us
together um that uh of all all Navy
officers retired.
>> Wow, that's incredible.
>> I'm proud of that. Yeah. Here I am,
these two giants, and I'm just happen to
be there along for the ride.
>> You're a giant, too. You have an amazing
history.
>> Not like those guys, but
>> I don't know. I think you're being
humble.
>> But Victor Victor is interested. We gave
him the presentation on Atlantis and he
said, "All right, I'm in."
>> Wow.
>> Yeah. And u
>> that's a great guy to be working with.
>> He's fantastic. So, one of my favorite
things about him, too, is the Navy named
a ship after him.
>> No way.
>> Yeah. The surveillance ships that that I
mentioned, acoustic intelligence
specialist, potentially identifying an
anomalous object in the ocean. Those
ship those ships, there's a class of
them, a new class that do have active
and passive sonar and find enemy
submarines. The new class uh is named
after Don Walsh and the first ship is
the Don Walsh and the second ship is the
Victor RCOBO. Wow.
>> And we had a big ship naming ceremony
with the Secretary of the Navy at the
Naval Academy last year and and and
Victor invited me.
>> That's amazing.
>> And I was even more proud the night
before he had a small family get
together, a dinner, and he invited Karen
and I
>> and my wife Karen being a Navy diver, uh
we an oceanographer, it was it was a
neat it was a really special night.
>> Wow. That's so cool. Do you ever look
into the history of the Navy? Like look
at I don't know
>> all the time. Yeah. I I I've studied the
Navy's history ever since I was a
midshipman. I love I love naval history.
>> I I'm you know way more more kind of
fair weather fan than than than you are
obviously with your uh experience, but
um I look into certain people like you
know Hyman Rickover and John Pena
Craraven and Oh yeah. I I'm always
wonder you know what they might have
known about UFOs. Himman Rickover is,
you know, head of the nuclear navy.
That's right. And
>> founder. Yeah. Do you think that um
>> Yeah. Do you think those guys ever, you
know, knew anything about UFOs uh at
all? So, uh probably. And here's
something interesting. Just recently, uh
and this this builds off research that,
uh Sam Gerbus, UAP Gerb, have you had on
your show?
>> Yeah, he's been on the show. Yeah. Yeah.
He's great.
>> Uh yeah. And so he this is something he
uncovered that I I thought was
remarkable. He found I think it was him
uh found a video of former I believe
director of national intelligence or
naval intelligence Bobby Ray Inman
Admiral
>> uh he mentioned dur this is well after
retirement at some event he mentioned
the national under underwater or
undersea reconnaissance office neuro uh
and so he he basically acknowledged it
was a real thing. In all my years in the
Navy as as the O head oceanographer and
knowing having access to undersea
classified programs, I've never even
heard of that organization.
>> Really?
>> No, I never I didn't think it was real.
>> Whoa.
>> So, obviously it is real and it is so
classified. I didn't even get a reading.
>> Whoa.
>> You would think the head oceanographer
that that there'd be some there's
there's no boundary. There's a boundary
there and and I I didn't cross it.
>> Well, you you look up. So, yeah. Nuro's
National Underwater Reconnaissance
Office. You look it up and the Wikipedia
is five lines long.
>> And I mean, even the NRO, which they I
guess they call it the the the the
little brother to the NRO or the
undersea brother. And the NRO um was
only I think made public in the '9s. So
for for for 20 30 years, I think it was
totally off the bus.
>> That's right. That's right. So that that
and I know I know why because at least
that again undersea technology is that's
can't be compromised because that's will
keep our shore safe keep keep give us an
edge in in any fight and uh um so and
it's interesting for example there's a
book out there called Blind Man's Bluff
book.
>> Oh yeah so that and and that's um
>> uh a lot a lot of the uh submarine
community is not happy about that book
being published. Oh yeah it's all their
trade secrets. So but ultimately uh so
that's how tight that kind of a
technology capability is and if if as in
our earlier discussion there are
undersea UAP
uh those would be the assets that would
have observed them.
>> Interesting.
>> And that and so ultimately then that
means yeah there there are Navy folks
who uh uh admirals in history who who
probably knew about this. Uh I I but I
don't know for sure
>> because Bobby Ray Inman I believe set up
Nuro according to Gerb and he then I
believe on a phone call with Bobby Oxler
this UFO researcher says yeah maybe UFOs
might come out at some point kind of
implying like he knows there's a there's
a there there
>> do do you uh anticipate that any of the
recovered vehicles would ever be uh
become available for uh technological
research? Again, I honestly don't know.
>> Uh there's a possibility.
>> And so, yeah, who knows? But, uh
>> so here's something interesting, too. Uh
I believe it's the abyss. There's a a
thread there somewhere in the movie
about these divers using liquid oxygen
or or or a derivative basically
immersing in in the and having a fully
um not breathing air but breathing a
liquid
>> which sounds terrifying to me because
you basically got to drown first, right?
And and in the movie they take a rat and
do you remember this part of it? They
take a rat and they put him into the
solution and it's of course reacts.
Doesn't want to drown. All of a sudden
it inhales the water and feels starts to
breathe. You don't know about this, do
you?
>> No.
>> So, here you go.
>> No, man. She's going to drown. Look.
Look. She's freaking out.
>> She's going through a normal adjustment
period.
>> Norma, does this look normal to you?
She's going to drown.
>> He's taking the fluid into his lungs.
He's taking the fluid into his lungs.
There he goes. So, there's a bit of
anxiety here now. He's starting to
relax. He's breathing fine. See his
chest moving, getting plenty of oxygen.
>> Damn rat's breathing that The
>> There is a There is a a a special unit,
I'm not going to say exactly where, of
Navy divers that have experimented with
that technology.
>> Whoa.
>> And it gives them longer bottom times
and all this, but it's very um
dangerous. And um and so this is a very
uh highly classified unit that uh I know
about and my wife didn't even know about
this until I learned later. And so they
experiment with that kind of technology.
And if any anybody does crash retrieval,
by the way, Eric Davis has said there
are more crash retrieval operations that
have been occurred in the ocean than
elsewhere.
>> That's wild. And then
>> so and the units that do that
>> is these guys.
>> Whoa. Oh, so is does an admiral know
about that in the past and today?
Probably. And they they don't say
anything.
>> I wonder about like Glowar Explorer too,
huge corporation and a lot of these kind
of
>> So they were they were the ones that was
the one to recover the the Soviet sub.
>> The Soviet sub.
>> The Soviet sub. That was it. Yeah.
>> Yeah. So I you know I wonder if any of
these things are dual use and um yeah
it' be
>> why not if you have uh some great
capability you that's what you would
use. And and Bob Lazar, it's
interesting. So he did this first kind
of press run and he talked about
obviously element 115 reverse
engineering a craft at S4 Area 51 and he
recently there was a documentary that
came out about him and he just did some
other interviews and he goes actually I
didn't mean archaeological dig. I meant
this was a Navy find on the seafloor.
From what Barry said that was an
archaeological dig which by the way
isn't in the desert, it's in the water.
Yeah. that was happened upon by the Navy
>> and
that's that's all I know and so I I find
that to be very interesting data point
what he has to say about that.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean not much more
than that. That's kind of you know but
you also have Pax River is very
interesting. Um I just had on uh
Missouri Representative Congressman Eric
Berles who's a great guy.
>> I like that guy.
>> He's super kind of straight shooter on
>> What does he know about Pax River? Well,
he visited Pax River and he said, you
know, and it's public that, you know,
it's probably the most advanced, you
know, aviation naval aviation facility
in the US. And he he visited and he
said, if we if we were to store a craft,
it would be here.
>> And I'll tell you, just being there and
seeing it,
>> um, if you were ever going to do a
transfer, it would be logistically the
perfect venue to do that. And he said
maybe there was even like a you know
that that that locked trying to
excfiltrate their UFO so that Bigalow
could have their eyes on it and look at
it. Maybe that craft was held there. And
so that was fascinating. Again, who
knows?
>> I used to live by there. Yeah, that's
very fascinating. I I would like to
know.
>> Yeah, same. Um and then of course you
have Do you know about this bluegill
triple prime test? This
>> very very much. Me my wife and I helped
Jeff Krugshank write the report on it.
>> Oh wow. Yeah.
>> Okay. So, you're familiar with this?
>> There's a whole section of he wrote this
report and uh there's a whole section
where we examine deck logs of ships that
we think were involved in some partial
recovery of either that object or
something related to it.
>> This is amazing. So, the context for
this is Harold Malgrren who is this kind
of elder statesman. You know,
>> you interviewed him. It was a great
interview.
>> Thank you. I appreciate really Pipa is
wonderful. I wish
>> she's amazing.
>> I wish I met him. It's an honor for you
to have
>> it. It was a total honor and I you know
I felt in many ways unqualified but just
really as I do here but it was just a
great uh beautiful interaction kind of
at the end of his life. He talked about
actually holding the pieces from this
crash and that uh it came down I guess
out of the plume of this nuclear blast
in 1962 in October. Um you had this
bluegill triple prime test. He said,
"Well, he reached for some stuff sitting
on his desk.
The these are things that have come
down.
I'm looking at sitting on his desk,
round rock, you know.
>> So, you're looking at like material,
anomalous material."
>> Yeah.
>> Debris.
>> Yeah.
>> And there were these Navy deck logs and
I believe there might have even been an
outage on one of the ships. Like there
was some radioactive Yeah.
>> Everything shut down. Yeah. They lost
power. And then there's this um soapas
uh uh special officer present a float.
>> Senior officer present a float. There
you go. You wouldn't know. Um so General
Starboard I believe was his name.
>> Oh, Admiral
>> Admiral Starboard. Great.
>> You're helping me walk through this. And
he and he flew, I believe, to the US in
seemingly this kind of like emergency
fit at 4:00 a.m. that night. Yeah. So,
it seems like something dropped out. And
then there's um a guy who used the
Freedom of Information Act to request
all records of UAV, UAP, UFO, any
acronym related to UFO from the Starfish
Prime series. And they were like, "Yeah,
we have responsive records, but we had
to forward them to the special uh, you
know, to the subject matter expert who
knows about this." Yeah. The NNSA said
this.
>> Oh. Oh, yeah. So, who was that that
requested them?
>> It was an anonymous requesttor. So, you
know, maybe you have to put, you know,
adjust your your, you know, belief in
that somewhat based on that. But, you
know, it seemed like a real request and
it seemed like he screenshotted the
response. So, um, it seems like there's
a tapestry of evidence that a UFO might
have come out of this plume from
Bluegill Triple Prime and it's it's just
amazing. I'm I I'm again, not 100% but
very highly likely. I'm convinced it
did. Yeah. And so that's what happened
is we we went and looked at all the deck
logs for Jeff because he
>> great guy by the way, really diligent
researcher, nice person too. Uh and
>> uh because we know how we could read a
deck log and know exactly what's going
on. And so okay, the ship's doing this,
this is what happened and and we were
able to interpret for him what we think
was going on. Did you think that
something anomalous was recovering on
the deck? I do.
>> Wow. So, this is fascinating and I love
that you're saying this because you have
the authority to say it and there are a
bunch of other people who are weighing
in and they're like, "It's the
instrumentation pod or it's the booster
or whatever." Oh, yeah. Well, there
there's there's that there was there
were there were those. Mhm.
>> Um but then then but you have to line up
there's there's other elements of that
recovery operation that are very
anomalous and then and then then some
things that aren't even in the deck log
uh that that you could tell that they
should have been cited and weren't
because we know the history. He went and
researched the history. Why didn't they
put that in the deck log? There's a
personnel transfer of divers from one to
the other.
>> Yeah.
>> This is fascinating.
>> So I I I let me let me draw back. I
can't say 100% because I didn't see the
object.
>> Sure. But that there was some there was
a highly unusual operation that occurred
and some of it was not recorded.
>> I think so too.
>> Yeah. Because there's there's a section
where they're um when they do make this
first recovery attempt, they're doing
all these engine orders and and um uh if
I recall, I I have to go look at the
report again, but um and they were
laying out all this anchor line. Okay,
that was that was the that was the now I
remember they laid out all this anchor
line where previously when they anchored
they only laid out a little bit because
they were they were going to pull up the
the hook as they call it uh very soon
after. So there's no need to set out a
lot along uh a lot of anchor line um if
you're going to move the next day. But
there's this there's this portion where
they laid out a ton of shot. That's the
term that you say. Uh because they were
going to do something that was going to
be really heavy lifting.
>> You know, spending time with Harold. I
that guy wasn't alive.
>> Yeah. Well, there you go. No, no, he has
nothing to He had nothing to gain at
that point.
>> Nothing to gain. Nothing to gain. I'm
glad. And it was so sweet of of Pippa to
be with him and have you. That was a
great interview.
>> Thank you. Well, he was he was amazing
and uh you know he yeah he's just an
incredible guy. Um how do we get back to
the future when it comes to our oceans
because I think about the 50s60s7s and
you had seab and you had you know and
then you had this unfortunate death on
CAB but you had this idea of aquinauts
you know now we think of just
astronauts.
>> We're getting there are we getting
there?
>> First off there's a cool thing about
CAB.
>> Yeah.
>> I happen and this is in my book too. I
happen to be at Stennis Space Center.
That's where my command was stationed.
Uh and you know that that's the nature
of NASA stations is you often have
multi-uses. So you have some Navy units,
maybe you have there's actually a Navy
Seal unit there, too. But um and so we
were there all and they had some special
event one day that I went to and it
involved some of the Mercury astronauts
giving a small talk because they were on
a road show to promote uh some some NASA
space related education initiative and
so big auditorium full of the three
astronauts. It was Wally Sherro, Gordon
Cooper, and Scott Carpenter,
heroes here. And I had a chance to hear
them speak. And then the audience of
course asked all the normal questions
about space. A lot of high school kids
there and uh and so what's it like to be
an astronaut and zero gravity and how do
you go to the bathroom and all those
things, little kids do that. I got up
and I asked Scott Carpenter, I said
because he'd been at CAB. He was the
only guy, one of the few people who had
been an astronaut and an aquinaut. And
so I asked him, "How do you compare the
two?" And he said, he said, "Oh, going
up in space is just glorious. It's
you're shot on the end of a rocket. You
get up there and everything's bright and
beautiful and and you come back and you
know after not very long and it's just
the most amazing uh experience of of a
lifetime." and and then he paused and he
said, "Well, but when you go in the
ocean, things are really hard and they
break and it's cold."
>> So, he had nothing good about it. He
just it was just it was a lot of
challenges and and I don't know when the
death occurred, but uh yeah, and I know
this from my wife being a diver, the
ocean is a very hard environment to
operate in. And and it's funny because I
left that meeting going how funny uh or
ironic that remember Kennedy gave his
big speech at Rice University. We choose
to go to the moon in this decade and do
the other things not because they are
easy but because they are hard.
>> Yeah.
>> And here is here is Scott Carpenter
telling me that operating in space is a
cakewalk but going in the ocean is
another story which I know to be true
from Victor's expedition because he
actually got it all documented on a
Discovery Channel channel series and
things break and and comms you lose
comms and all this. So at any rate
though uh technology is allowing us to
move beyond that and I actually have
advised a new company called deep
>> that's just their name and they're
building an ocean habitat. It's already
deployed in the Florida Keys National
Marine Sanctuary which is like an
underwater national park that Noah
manages
>> and uh and so this is they just
installed it and their chief scientist
is a wonderful woman named Don Krengus
and she's already I think she's already
dived the habitat. So I'm my goal is to
go dive that habitat soon.
>> Wow.
>> Yeah. So that that's there. There's
another one. I gave a talk last year at
EarthX, an environmental conference. And
>> I did a fireside chat like we're doing
here with uh a NASA, former NASA
astronaut called names named uh Dr.
Scott Perisinski. is an MD and he was
the head space walker for NASA for a
while
>> and he now is an adviser for a new
company
>> and I the name escapes me I think it's
Proteus and is one of the Custoau sons
founded it and they're building ocean
habitats too
>> so when you think about those and the
fact that new technologies like autonomy
robots robotics are advancing so rapidly
uh and look look at what Victor did I
we're going to see more and more of
I'm so excited because we're we're we've
mapped more of the moon and Mars than we
have our own planet. Isn't that right?
>> Right. And that's another thread take us
down about undersea UAP that that yes,
we know not only more of the seabed or
pardon me the we've mapped the moon the
surfaces of moon and Mars to a higher
resolution than our seabed. Uh we've
only mapped 27% of of the seafloor to
modern standards. That's so much
territory. And then and it's 70% of the
planet. And so and then we've only
explored with with drifters, floats, and
drones about 10% of and ROVs 10% of the
ocean volume.
>> So this could be an answer to the Fermy
paradox.
>> Yeah. Where is everybody? Exactly.
They're in the oceans where they are.
>> Exactly.
>> And and we know the they UAP, whatever
is controlling it, they're they're
elusive. They are not just showing up
and announcing themselves. And so the
that fact and and the the large
territory of the ocean that we know
nothing about really points in the
direction that that's that's probably
where they are.
>> Yeah. Fellow UAP White House adviser um
Kevin can Yeah.
>> He has a great theory about
>> Quick correction.
>> Yeah, go for it.
>> We're not we're not reporting to the
White House.
>> Okay.
>> We we report to the ODNI.
>> Okay. Got it. Of course, the White House
as the White House does, you know, the
Department of War reports to the NSC
>> and so and then they they're both NSC is
a White House body. ODNI
uh supports the White House and reports
to the White House. So, we have that
layer there. Got it. Okay. Yeah. Good
correction. Um he uh talks about water
worlds and basically planets that have
water as being like the perfect kind of
Goldilock zone because obviously you
have phase transitions. you have, you
know, solid, liquid, gas, plasma. And so
if you can have a liquid form of water,
it's like an indication that you're in
some sort of Goldilocks zone. Oh, yeah.
>> And so you have Mars is way too cold.
You have Venus is way too hot as an
example. So we're this, you know, this
perfect sort of third planet distance
away from the from the sun. And so if
you have other water worlds, maybe
that's where you'd have this Cardartesev
four scale civilization that is really
advanced. And so maybe, you know, if
there is kind of an interstellar
highway, the the kind of connective
thread as to where they camp out on
different planets is they would camp out
in water worlds. Interesting. Yeah,
there's a of course there not not so
habitable but the moons of uh Jupiter
and Saturn Enceladus and Europa.
>> Mhm.
>> They're I think
hypothesized to have ocean interiors
with uh ice ice exteriors.
>> Yes. And so NASA has been working to
build capabilities that that actually
funded some of our work to uh um what
the goal was to basically land on the
surface and then punch a hole and send
in a remotely operated vehicle. And
>> so some of our Noah ROV work, we have an
exploration ship called the Okianis
Explorer. We uh I think NASA supported
to to advance that technology that they
could eventually apply for missions to
those moons.
>> That would be amazing. That's so cool.
What's cool about about that is um kind
of related uh is that NASA astronauts
all train in Houston
>> uh in this
>> one of the largest pools in the world.
>> It's called the neutral buoyancy lab.
>> Okay.
>> Have you ever heard of it?
>> No.
>> It's so cool. So, uh yeah. And so
basically they all wear their space gear
in this pool to simulate neutral
buoyancy, gravity free. And uh and so
what's neat about that is now in my my
my whole past government work I uh I've
been working for companies and the the
prime contractor for that comp that uh
that facility the neutral buoyancy lab
is is a um is a company called Rothy
>> and they they're going public and they
wanted me to come on their board and so
I got to go down there and check out
that that whole awesome setup and they
have a whole team of divers that support
the astronauts. So sooner or later
they're going to have a VIP diving day
and my wife and I are going to go down
and get on a scuba and go dive that tank
with astronauts.
>> Wow, that's amazing.
>> Anyways,
>> all kind of related stuff there.
>> Speaking of, you know, maybe geothermal
pockets that are habitable within ice.
Do you think that anything might be
residing in Antarctica that we're not
aware of?
>> Yeah, there's isn't there there's a lot
about that possibility. Uh, and I think
who was say someone thought that Admiral
Bird had some encounter when he was down
there.
>> Yeah, exactly. There are
>> I know nothing of that. And I have
friends who worked in Antarctica. I have
friends know of friends who previously
had been ice divers down there.
>> And then I have a another colleague
who's a very accomplished underwater
photographer named um Becky Shot and she
is uh does expeditions down there all
the time and is a very accomplished
diver, ice diver. Nobody I know who's
been down there and there are many uh
have have seen anything. I've heard the
reports but right now I don't have any
data or
>> just legends for now.
>> Yeah. But um your your wife is a remote
viewer. Is that right? She just finished
this Paul Smith training.
>> Yes. Okay. This is this is a good line
of of inquiry because like mainstream
science as we've alluded to before uh I
don't know how it how it has been but
but in mainstream science uh
consciousness has not been treated as it
should be right and and the idea of all
these aspects of consciousness like
out-of- body experiences near-death
experiences uh and and and the the
survival of human consciousness after
death right after death. So uh and the
and and other related uh characteristics
phenomena like telepathy and so
just like UAP stigmatized that nothing
there there it's not real it's not
scientific. Well what we're seeing now
is whether it be the scientific study or
uh like with the division of perceptual
studies at University of Virginia. Do
you know that?
>> Yeah. Oh yeah.
>> Okay. those people, those fine people,
those scientists or Diane Hennessy
Powell and her work with a autistic
patients. How about that? Did you Did
you have her on her show?
>> Oh, yeah. I've had her on.
>> She talks about the conversations these
autistic kids have together.
>> Yeah. They commute on on a hill. It's
like kind of That's right. Uh uh almost
like um Meeting Station but in like, you
know, some like mental etheric form or
something. It's amazing.
>> Right. Yes. So there that is all real
right there. It's documented this this
is a real phenomena and now taking it to
the applied level
>> uh uh in this case of remote viewing.
First off, Hal Pudof is a good friend
and colleague of mine and
he he's shared extensively about his
experience with that the Stargate
program and then one of the Stargate
programs I believe founders was Paul
Smith
>> or Elise who was the Army guy and and
now he's he's taken that further. He's
written a manual on remote viewing and
it's all about Have you ever remote
viewed?
>> No, I've never remote viewed. you learn
you learn a protocol like like so many
uh I guess just experiences or methods
there there's a way to basically like
tap into that that that knowledge which
is out there all knowledge is somehow
interconnected and so Karen has taken
one basic course and then she just
finished the advanced course she
actually went to his place in in Cedar
City Utah and and did she's really good
by the way and so what happens they'll
They'll give you a the facilitator gives
you a a target basically a set of
pictures with a grid coordinate of
somewhere a facility a natural formation
whatever and then so he's got this
target in mind and then uh I guess what
all he does is reveal to the viewer the
the coordinates of it and this is a
protocol that started out at Stargate
and they did it kind of worked it over
time with really talented remote viewers
like Ingo Swan.
>> Yeah. And um yeah, and Joe McMonagle,
yeah, one of your guests.
>> Oh, yeah. I love him.
>> Oh, he's brilliant. And
>> so Karen took took it all and she and it
works. It's really remarkable because
she'll okay, she'll and you go through a
set of things where you sort of
basically clear your mind and then then
sometimes now your your mind is always
when you're getting a perception, this
is perception uh of something, your your
mind will automatically want to make
sense of it.
>> Okay? If you're if you're seeing, for
example,
um like a wooden tone or something,
you're going to go, "Okay, it's like
it's you're going to build a table right
there in your mind." You do that. You
make a mental model and they in the
protocol, you you learn to recognize
when your mind's doing that and you shut
it off.
>> Okay. And they call it analytical
overlay. You know about it?
>> Oh, yeah.
>> Okay. Okay. There you go.
>> Yeah.
>> And so Karen's she's I won't say she's
mastered this, but she's t done this for
two years now, and she's really good.
Wow. And he's he has nailed these
targets. he's gotten to her where she'll
just start drawing it out. She'll start
naming all the all the um kind of
associations she's getting whether the
shape, the color, the the texture.
She'll she'll start with words and then
she'll start drawing aspects of it. And
I even participated in an experiment and
I there are instances where I I got the
target spot on and so I did I even toyed
with it. I was part of their little
experiment group and uh so she and she's
gotten them right on the money and these
aren't things you can make up. it'd be
one of her targets was this really cool
geological formation in a national park
and she drew she drew them just to a
tea.
>> Wow.
>> You know, it wasn't it wasn't
Disneyland, you know, it wasn't the
space station. It was that and she drew
exactly that.
>> That's incredible.
>> She's done it multiple times. Yeah.
>> Wow.
>> So that that and this is whole thing
consciousness studies. I I I I hope as
UAP may be becoming that more of our and
especially this because more of our
society that accepts this nature of
humanity this this true the truth the
real nature of humanity there's so much
we can do with that
human potential is so held back by our
not accepting the full uh uh
possibilities of our consciousness and
and um and human connection
Yeah.
>> Yeah. Like all the UFO infighting.
>> Yeah.
>> If you once you really get to understand
the nature of your mind and other and
connecting with other minds,
>> maybe all that'll stop.
>> Yeah. Totally. And I mean that's on the
line, right? It's like uh the nature of
consciousness and the nature of reality
and and and truth about metaphysics and
stuff and you know it is a great book.
>> Well, it's a great book. Uh have you
read Dan Brown's Secret of Secrets? you
know, uh, Brandon Fugal just he was just
on the show and he just brought that up.
>> It's you, if you care about this topic,
read it. He has mastered the story. It's
a great story line, too, by the way.
But, uh, he goes into all of this. You
will be, if you're on the fence about
this this nature of consciousness, you I
would think you will be a firm, not you
won't believe, you will know when you
finish reading this book.
>> I can't wait to read.
>> Oh gosh, it's good. Yeah,
>> that's amazing. He's so I would love to
interview him. I think he lives in New
Hampshire or some somewhere northeast.
Yeah, just an amazing I mean I've read
Angels and Demons and the Da Vinci Code
and stuff. He's amazing.
>> Yeah, he's really incredible.
>> Do you ever use remote viewing like
daily life for like decision- making or
anything?
>> Well, no. Uh because again I you have to
be disciplined about the protocol to
it's just a there's an aspect of how
your mind works. It's very hard to
filter out. Uh and so um and I I've just
not practiced it enough. And however
though in intuition so we're very
related. Okay. When you and and you also
you also at the beginning we all talked
about intention. Yes you did. And I I I
I think that's a really important part
of this conversation that when your
intention is good and positive I think
then uh then I think your mind for some
reason is
it's more accessible. Your consciousness
is expanded in a way when you have good
intention.
>> I think so too. I
>> I think that's the secret of all of this
whole topic is it unlocks for you when
you have really pure intentions and when
you're seeking truth and you don't have
ulterior motives. You know, I think good
things happen and
>> they do and my life is is is an example
of that where and I actually again my
book there's a lot of stories I have in
this about it's better to be lucky than
good.
>> Oh, I love that. and and but it's really
about having pure positive intention.
Whenever I've had that, good things
happen, great things happen. It was
about my going to the naval academy
really quickly. So, there's a whole
story in there. I shouldn't have gone
in, but I I wanted to study the ocean
and I wanted to serve my country.
>> And what happened uh you like stories,
so you're a storyteller.
>> Yeah. So I uh I so I was I wanted to do
this from an early age and and um and I
and I kind of misguided but I also
wanted to get a PhD from scripts and I I
learned that the Naval Academy had one
scholarship to Scripps and I thought
okay I want to study the ocean. It's got
a pathway to Scripps Scripps Institution
of Oceanography in La Hoya California
with Woods Hole the top two
oceanographic schools in the country the
world. So, I wanted that and uh I I I go
to the academy, I show up on the very
first day and uh they take all the
physical tests you took before to get in
and so I retake them and I get to this
color vision test. Uh have you ever
taken a color vision test?
>> I don't think I have.
>> So, in the Navy, you get tested for
everything. And so color vision test is
called the Ishahara test named after a
certain uh scient I guess doctor
physician and he this test consists of
uh a circular grouping of of of
basically dots colored dots and the dots
are in different colors and they all
make out a number 10 12 7 8 but you can
always see the orange eight uh in the
green and reds in his background. Right.
Okay. So, and this is this is this is to
test you for a very common genetic uh uh
trait of color defectiveness in men.
>> Some women, but mostly men have it. And
you there are a lot of people in the
population have it. I don't know the
number, but it's not small. And so, but
unfortunately, that disqualifies you
from naval service because in naval
service, you need to be able to see
green and red very clearly because th
those are the lights, navigation lights
on ships. So when you go to on or or
aircraft and so if you can't understand
the lights on a ship, you're not going
to know the configuration. You could
potentially have problems navigating.
It's really a strict requirement. I go
take that test on the day my first day
at the academy, July 2nd, 1985. And I
failed that test. And the coreman
administering it said, and we're all
getting back to pure intention, okay? He
said, "Whoa, how did you even get
accepted here? Go to the side. We're
going to report you. You're going to
you're going to be gone." And oh my
gosh. So, I go to my I tell my dad and
and and the swim coach who recruited me.
Oh, no. And they run around and go off
and and ultimately I I take a weight.
And um what happens behind the scenes is
the co I I was the fastest 500
freestyler in the country in uh prep for
prep schools uh in in uh that year.
>> Wow. Wow.
>> So, I was recruited heavily and uh the
coach found out and he reported it to
the athletic director and they decided
to give me something they' never done
before,
>> a waiver letter that I signed
acknowledging that I couldn't go to the
traditional line office officer uh
specialties, surface aircraft pilot,
submarine that I could only when I
graduate do restricted work that
involved either intelligence, medical or
oceanography. So, it's what I wanted and
it was actually given to me even though
I shouldn't even gotten in.
>> Wow.
>> And they accept me. I go in and here I
am. I should never even gone. Wow.
>> And I did and I followed the exact path
I wanted to follow. So, and I was and I
was and there's this is not even the
only time in my book where I talk about
this where I had good intention and I
should never have gotten it.
>> But some and somehow I think that was it
is I wanted a good path and uh and the
universe opened it up for me.
>> Well, that's a beautiful thing. What's
the most precarious situation you've
ever been in in in uh the Navy? Okay,
good. So, there's the Navy. Uh no doubt,
and I tell this story, too. I was a uh I
was on an aircraft carrier and I was my
job was the officer of the deck. So, I
was in charge I was a ship's
oceanographer, but I had a division of
aerographers mates that predicted
weather and I didn't really need to step
in that much. So, I I I became a deck
watch officer. So I was in charge of the
ship for two 4-hour stretches a day
directing all movements right left ahead
uh slow down launch aircraft recover
aircraft don't don't you know don't
launch aircraft don't recover aircraft
giving all the orders for this aircraft
car in two combat operations enduring
freedom when we first flew strikes into
Afghanistan I came at the tail end of
that and then we did all the strikes
into Iraq in 2003 during Iraqi freedom
so big high stress job uh and at one
point we going to their Persian Gaul for
Iraqi freedom. We're going through the
straight of Malaa. And when you do that,
um you're I'm driving the aircraft
carrier. You're you're 100 feet off the
water line. You're you're way up there.
And um we uh narrow waterway because the
USS Cole had been bombed a few years
before. We were really wary of any
terrorist attacks. So we launched our
helicopters. That was the protocol with
50 cal machine guns and they were
basically patrolling for any small boats
that would try to attack us and and so
the we're driving I have a destroyer
who's about
thousand yards on my port bow ahead of
me to the to the port and she was the
USS Curtis Wilbur and um and so we and
we have a strike group commander embark
and he gives all the orders to the
strike group. So, I'm driving the ship,
the aircraft carrier, the Kittyhawk, and
uh and they they give the order for the
Curtis Wilbur. Oh, first. So, we
launched the helicopters to watch out
for terrorists. And because we launched
helicopters, when there's anything uh
any aircraft in the air, we need to have
what they call a plane guard, a ship to
go behind us in case someone crashes and
they can recover the pilot. So, uh, they
give the order, Curtis Wilbur, go take
plane guard off the Kittyhawks, uh, uh,
stern, you know, at such and such a
distance. And what normally should have
happened is I'm driving, he's she's
ahead of me, and she should have just
peeled off to port. It would have been
an easy day, and she would just slow
down and take station behind me. Um,
she ended up turning to starboard. and
and she was so close and it happened so
quickly that as she turned to starboard
the the flight deck ahead of me there's
basically an 800t shadow zone of
seawater that I can't see oh and her bow
basically disappeared right like in that
shadow zone that's how close she was I'm
going 12 knots or so and and I and
immediately of course um I do everything
I'm supposed to do I I yell out right
hard rudder all engines a head flank to
just make me do that. Sound the
collision alarm. Um and uh announce
brace for shock and uh and then and then
you know this happens when people get in
these situations. Uh time just totally
slowed down for me. Uh and I remember
having all these thoughts. I thought oh
my god we are going to cut that ship in
half and there's nothing I can do about
it. And and that that would have been
that would have it would likely would
have sunk. We would have had at least
200 people killed, probably more. All
sailors dying, very horrible deaths. I
mean, fires, sinking. It was just the
worst image I've ever seen in my life
mentally.
>> And then I thought, "Oh my god, we're
going to get hit and and we're going to
probably end up having some some um
water come in and damage control
necessary where we'd call general
quarters and I'd call general quarters
and then fires would break out. my
sailors might be fighting those fires
actually and some of our sailors might
get killed. All these things flooded my
mind before you know that in that one
second and thank god uh the ship did the
right thing at the right time and
shifted her rudder and she just barely
avoided us. Of course the captain's on
the phone with the admiral and every a
big swirl of activity there afterwards.
Um but that that was that was the most
precarious thing and there was really
nothing I could do. It was just because
we were in that close quarters
maneuvering in a straight.
>> Um yeah, but
>> that's intense.
>> Also, all I can tell you is I am I have
been blessed. Uh in this book, I talk
about these times where uh challenging
situations again working for Trump and
it worked out. We we achieved good.
Thankfully, the the alternative didn't
occur and I just feel like I've had this
very gifted life and that's why I wanted
to tell my story.
>> That's beautiful. Well, don't ask
questions. Keep keep riding the wave.
>> Well, actually, you're right about that
because as we talked about uh there
there's some exciting possibilities
ahead for us, for humanity, and I'm
excited to contribute to that.
>> Yeah. Well, I think you are contributing
to it and uh everybody go buy the book
Holding Fast in the Heavy Seas and uh
I'm just really honored.
>> Oh, by the way, V V V V V V V V V V V V
V V V V V V V V Victor wrote an
endorsement.
>> Oh, did he? Oh, cool.
>> I got to tell you, I'm I'm blessed. I
have some great endorsements. Victor
wrote one. Um
>> one of my favorite ocean authors. So, as
we talk about the oceans in UAP, if
anybody any of your listeners, viewers
like the ocean, they should read uh any
of the books by the the the topline
endorser, Susan Casey.
>> She's this really brilliant writer, New
York Times bestseller multiple times,
has a latest book about undersea
exploration called The Underworld. She's
written a book about about waves called
The Wave. She goes and rides a um a jet
ski with Lar Hamilton into the lineup at
at Peah, you know, Jaws. Oh, yeah.
>> Yeah. There's some good That's a great
book. And uh and she has a book about
dolphins called Voices in the Ocean.
>> And um and another really cool book. I
talked about Noah having national marine
sanctuaries or n underwater national
parks.
>> She wrote a book about the the sanctuary
in the Fereralone Islands off of uh San
Francisco and all their history about
the great white shark population that
lives there. Wow, she sounds amazing.
>> It's called Devil's Teeth.
>> Devil's Teeth.
>> And she always goes in the field for all
of her work. So, you know what? Oh, by
the way, so her book about the about
exploration of the ocean called The
Underworld,
>> she goes and dives the Mariana's Trench
with Victor.
>> Whoa.
>> Yeah. So,
>> shout out to Susan Casey.
>> Susan Casey is a legend.
>> She is. She's She's brilliant.
>> Wow.
>> That I Yeah. Getting that endorsement
was is just such an honor for me.
>> That's amazing. Can I ask you a final
question?
>> Yeah.
>> Um, if you were an alien civilization,
where would you hide out under the
ocean? What principles?
>> I don't I don't have to be an alien to
want to be in the ocean. Fair enough.
>> I told you that. That was my whole
career.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, you're already
into it.
>> Well, in fact, in fact, that's it. I'm
so lucky now. I Me and my wife dive the
world because I'm not in the government
anymore and we have time. Wow.
>> So, we just finished diving the Blue
Hole in Bise.
>> Oh, cool.
>> Which is this really cool feature. We
did it with our our daughters and uh and
we also did uh um Iron Bottom Sound off
Guadal Canal. Have you ever heard of
that?
>> No.
>> Naval history.
>> Okay.
>> Okay. So, in 1942,
>> this was a real precarious use that word
again time in World War II when um it
was the first time after Midway, the
Battle of Midway that we went on the
offensive and we decided to take a
Japanese airfield in the Solomon Islands
and it was on this island called Guala
Canal. It was this obscure area, but it
was that kind of that point where we
basically we and Japan met halfway. They
were advancing. We were going on the
offensive and it was the place to take
hold of an airfield. And then from
there, we launched the island hopping
campaign that assured us victory. So in
1942, there was this place where there
was almost a year of continuous naval
action, ships, shink sinking ships. And
this there's so many shipwrecks in this
little area off of Guadal Canal. They
call it Iron Bottom Sound.
>> Wow.
>> Yeah. And so my wife and I went and
dived there.
>> Oh, wow.
>> On some of the wrecks there. That was
phenomenal. So
>> that's incredible.
>> I'm not sure what's next. Oh, I knew
we're going to Bermuda. So Bermuda
Triangle. We're going to dive the
Bermuda Triangle.
>> Do you think there's something to the
Bermuda Triangle legends of
electromagnetic anomalies and flights
going missing and that sort of thing? Uh
there seem there's there's data there's
evidence of anomalies.
>> Yeah.
>> So let's tie this all together now.
>> Yeah.
>> Undersea bases possibly, right? We know
five to seven locations.
>> Yes.
>> Uh we have anomalies like at the ranch.
>> Mhm.
>> Uh
>> Bermuda Triangle.
>> Yeah.
>> Who knows? I'm I'm going to be I'm going
to be sailing through it with my family
on a cruise ship.
>> That's amazing.
>> And then we're going to dive off
Bermuda. Scuba dives. I'll let you know
what we find.
>> Oh, you're going to have a blast. Well,
keep with the proper intentions and
>> Amen.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And uh wow, that'll be
a lot of fun. And um yeah, it's just
been an honor. I really appreciate it,
Admiral. This has been a long time
coming for me. I've followed your work
for for many years now um in the UAP
topic, but obviously you have this
illustrious career, you know, behind
that where you're adding your
credentials to this kind of frontier.
And uh I'm just really grateful for you
coming. Hey, I am grateful to be here,
Jesse, and I'm just I'm honored and
delighted to be a fellow seeker of truth
with you.
>> Oh, there you go.
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Woo!