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[@ChrisWillx] The Darkest Philosophies You've Never Heard Of - Alex O’Connor & Joe Folley

· 5 min read
[@ChrisWillx] Summarizer
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@ChrisWillx - "The Darkest Philosophies You've Never Heard Of - Alex O’Connor & Joe Folley"

Link: https://youtu.be/9dTSNMjrJDY

Short Summary​

The video explores "dark" philosophies, particularly pessimistic ones like those of Emil Cioran and anti-natalism as presented by David Benatar. It suggests that engaging with such philosophies can, paradoxically, lower expectations and even lead to a sense of humor about life's inherent suffering, and recommends approaching philosophy by exploring thinkers who resonate with your existing interests rather than starting with canonical figures.

Key Quotes​

Here are four quotes extracted from the transcript that I found particularly insightful:

  1. "I often think philosophy is just clever branding for depressive thoughts."
  2. "...if you know you don't you're not expecting things to go very well and if you think the characteristic property of the of the world is meaningless suffering well then to a certain extent like the stakes are kind of lowered."
  3. "The greatest philosophers... tell you something you already know... It's just supposed to be sort of elucidating an idea... a lot of the time it is just sort of uh feeling out a vibe, finding someone who puts it into good words and saying, "Oh, I think that person's very me. I feel less alone.""
  4. "...in principle we are all disabled in some philosophical sense...imagine if everybody whose legs worked suddenly just died and the only people left on planet Earth like don't have functioning legs... it just wouldn't be considered a disability to not have legs because that's just how everybody is."

Detailed Summary​

Okay, here's a detailed summary of the YouTube video transcript in bullet points, focusing on the key topics, arguments, and information discussed:

Main Topic: Dark or Pessimistic Philosophies and Their Effects

  • The conversation starts with the meme about philosophy making people depressed and the idea that learning more worsens one's view of the world.
  • The core discussion revolves around exploring various philosophies considered "dark" or pessimistic.

Philosophers and Their Ideas Discussed

  • Emil Cioran (Romania/France):
    • Considered incredibly underrated and very pessimistic.
    • Works mentioned: The Trouble with Being Born, A Short History of Decay, On the Heights of Despair.
    • His writing often shifts the scope, starting with pessimistic complaints about life and subtly transitioning to light-heartedness.
    • Reading Cioran can lower expectations and make suffering almost comedic.
    • He's described as both one of the darkest and one of the funniest philosophers.
  • Schopenhauer:
    • Mentioned as an "indulgent pessimist."
    • Known for writings "on the sufferings of the world" and a controversial (and seriously meant, not sarcastic) essay on women.
  • Philip Mainländer: Mentioned as someone who could also be a considered a pessimistic philosopher.
  • David Benatar (Anti-Natalism):
    • The "superstar of anti-natalism."
    • Advocates that it is immoral to have children, even if their lives might be filled with more pleasure than suffering.
    • Book mentioned: Better Never to Have Been.
    • Provides a philosophical, rather than just emotional, argument for anti-natalism.
    • His perspective is described as a "third option" beyond pro-life and pro-choice, essentially "anti-life."
    • Explores the philosophy of disability, arguing that, in a philosophical sense, we are all disabled because we lack the potential to have everything.
    • Provides a logical, rather than poetic, argument.

Arguments and Perspectives

  • Pessimistic Philosophy and Lowered Expectations:
    • If you expect things to go poorly, the stakes are lowered, making it easier to cope with negative experiences.
    • Similar to Seneca's advice to imagine worst-case scenarios.
  • Comedic Relief in Suffering:
    • Extreme suffering can become so absurd that it's funny.
    • This dose-dependent response to suffering follows a U-shaped curve: little suffering is okay, some suffering is bad, a lot of suffering can become funny again.
  • Self-Indulgence in Pessimism:
    • Some pessimistic philosophers are accused of self-indulgence and using philosophy to mask personal problems (e.g., romantic rejection).
  • Philosophy as Clever Branding:
    • Philosophy can be seen as a way to systematize and brand thoughts, including depressive thoughts.
    • The greatest philosophers often articulate ideas that people already intuitively understand.
    • Reading philosophy can provide a sense of connection and reduce feelings of isolation.
  • How to Start Reading Philosophy:
    • Instead of a traditional chronological approach (Plato, Aristotle, etc.), start with philosophers you've already heard of or those related to your existing interests.
    • If you are a fan of Jordan Peterson, starting with Nietzsche would be beneficial.
    • Resonance and relevance are key to engaging with philosophical ideas.
  • Anti-Natalism is a Dark Philosophy:
    • Benatar makes a genuinely philosophical case for anti-natalism.
    • Anti-natalists believe that bringing someone into suffering is immoral.

Other Points

  • The discussants had a conversation about anti-natalism at a barbecue that people found off-putting.
  • David Benatar doesn't show his face or use his real name.
  • The conversation makes a lighthearted comparison of Benatar to Sleep Token.
  • An advertisement for Function Health, promoting blood work analysis and personalized health recommendations.

This summary captures the main points and nuances of the discussion. It highlights the philosophers mentioned, their key ideas, and the broader arguments about the nature and impact of "dark" or pessimistic philosophies.