[@JesseMichels] “My Gifted Education Was a Cover For UFO Research!” [EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW]

Link: https://youtu.be/PiFbeWfA3LM

Duration: 148 min

Transcript: Download plain text

Short Summary

Jordan Jose, a serial entrepreneur in treecare and agentic AI, describes spending two years as a child in a classified psychic development program at Baker Victory Services, where he claims to have trained on UAP piloting via the telepathic "Prometheus" system and encountered a sentient crystal orb called "Sylvia." Now working alongside David Grusch and Jake Barber on UAP disclosure, he frames UAPs as transdimensional, consciousness-based phenomena rather than extraterrestrial craft. The wide-ranging discussion covers directed energy weapons, Goethe's "cognition by identification," group coherence experiments, and the host announcing that American Alchemy is hiring an editor.

Key Quotes

1. "These UAP, UFO, other materials. They're not flown with joysticks. They're flown through the mind." (01:08:08)
2. "consciousness is actually the root of disclosure. Consciousness is the root of UAP and UFO phenomena. It's not necessarily a materialistic aspect." (01:44:47)
3. "it's a literal crystal orb, but the inside of this orb, for lack of a better word, was alive." (01:52:49)
4. "If your subconscious does not believe that whatever you're doing is possible, then your conscious mind will not allow it to be possible." (01:38:04)
5. "I'm high confidence in the fact that crash retrieval operations have shot many things with directed energy weapons." (01:28:43)

Detailed Summary

Episode Overview & Guest Profile

Jordan Jose appears on American Alchemy describing two years inside a classified psychic development program at Baker Victory Services, now working on UAP disclosure alongside David Grusch and Jake Barber. The wide-ranging discussion covers psionic training, UAP piloting via the "Prometheus" system, a sentient crystal orb called "Sylvia," and a thesis that UAPs are transdimensional consciousness phenomena rather than extraterrestrial craft.

• Jordan Jose is a serial entrepreneur in the treecare industry and applied agentic AI, with projects including wildfire prevention and next-generation research for utility companies as of late 2023.
• He beat cancer at age 20 and grew up in a small rural town believing he had a normal childhood before severe PTSD-level flashbacks began in early 2023, lasting roughly two months.
• His bio is at jordanjos.com, and he is preparing to release a Telepathy Center app at telepathycenter.com in June.

Childhood Testing & Removal from Public Schools

Jordan was pulled from Springville, NY public schools starting around age 9 for sessions lasting six hours to a full day with a team of psychologists, without teachers or the district being informed of the full nature of testing. His path from gifted identification to covert program placement involved several distinct phases spanning roughly 2004–2010.

• Starting around age 9 (fourth grade, between ages 9 and 14), Jordan attended sessions with psychologists six hours to a full day in length while remaining enrolled in Springville public schools.
• In 2004–2005 he was tested through the GATE (Gifted and Talented Education) program — started by Sydney Marland in 1972, pre-Church Committee — using the Woodcock test of achievement, which showed a large split between verbal and non-verbal scores and identified him as highly gifted without an autism or psychological diagnosis.
• Around 2008–2010, a mental health diagnosis overlay was used to remove him from the public school system; his mother tried to move him out of the district, but school personnel physically came to the house to remove him when he refused to attend.
• The Springville, NY home school district petitioned the state in 2010, after which the facility refused access for roughly 5 months; once a state audit was threatened, Jordan was returned home in September 2010 under a "severe mental illness" cover story, with all medications released within one year.

Baker Victory Services Facility

Jordan was placed at Baker Victory Services, a now-shut-down day treatment center at 650 Ridge Road in Western New York, affiliated with the Father Baker Catholic nonprofit serving foster and neurodivergent children. The facility combined standard special education with what Jordan describes as defense contractor research into psychic potential development.

• The facility held roughly 40 kids total, staffed with nurses, psychologists, and psychiatrists in an 8:1:1 special education structure, but internally supported defense contractor research into psychic potential.
• Security features in 2008 included badge in/badge out access, RFID throughout, no electronics allowed (including kids' PSPs), and Faraday-cage protection comparable to a SCIF.
• A $16 million new facility was built, marked by golden shovels; the facility later faced 400+ lawsuits for sexual abuse claims, and a $100 million sexual abuse lawsuit was settled.
• A supervisor was arrested on 210 felonies related to article and record manipulation, and three OLV Human Services employees at the Victory Learning Center in Lackawanna were placed on leave for physical mistreatment of students.
• 911 lines from the facility were reportedly surveilled; operators would take over and claim a child was prank dialing, preventing rescue attempts.
• After Baker Victory shut down, the organization rebranded as OLV Human Services; Jordan's mother received a letter offering settlement money in exchange for an NDA.

Pharmacological Interventions

Jordan's medical records document extensive and undisclosed substance administration, with trainers citing a critical prepubescent window of heightened extrasensory perception. The pharmacological regime was central to program operations and contributed to long-term health consequences.

• His records show he was administered over a dozen antipsychotics during a roughly two-year period, including Haldol and Zoloft, with additional undisclosed substances administered for specific sessions.
• Puberty blockers were among substances used, with trainers citing a prepubescent window of heightened extrasensory perception.
• Jordan developed cancer at a young age, which he attributes partly to the program; he beat cancer at age 20.

The "Sylvia" Crystal Orb Encounter

About three months before placement at Baker Victory, Jordan was shown a basketball-sized crystal orb called a "relic" under electromagnetic shielding. Within seconds of eye contact, the internal fractalized structure mirrored his eye movements and appeared to look back, leading to a telepathic connection with a feminine presence named Sylvia.

• The orb sat on a three-prong pedestal, slightly smaller than a basketball, with an outer shell and an internal fractalized structure resembling Jupiter's atmosphere — white, crystallized like a VVS diamond, and emitting its own light.
• Within ~2 seconds of locking eye contact, the interior adapted and appeared to look back; for 30 seconds the structure mirrored his eye movements; Jordan experienced intense fear and a somatic sensation in his brain.
• The psychologist told him, "You did great… it picks who it likes and I think it likes you," and staff called it a "relic" rather than disclosing its origin.
• The entity communicated telepathically as feminine and named itself "Sylvia" (a name later confirmed during an astral session); it was described as a "human thought form" that remained 100% neutral.
• Sylvia would only link with Jordan and refused to produce schematics or technical information for program staff.
• Jordan compared the orb to the sphere held by Christ in Leonardo da Vinci's Salvator Mundi painting, speculating it may be an ancient relic rather than extraterrestrial in origin.
• Recovered materials were brought into the facility by ~8 security personnel carrying a large box, and the technology would not respond to handlers but only to people with certain types of consciousness.

Psionic Training Program & Techniques

Training differed from Stanford Research Institute/Stargate CRV (controlled remote viewing), using a framework in which awareness is the substrate of the universe and practitioners shift awareness to become the target object itself. Jordan and other children were subjected to multi-modal cognitive reinforcement protocols.

• Jordan's schedule was 2–3 days per week in normal school and 2–3 days per week with a team of psychologists, researchers, and psychiatrists; after a 2–3 month normal period, interns were hired to work specifically on his case.
• The training framework holds that awareness is the substrate of the universe, and practitioners shift awareness to become the target object itself (e.g., a door, room, or filing cabinet).
• Partners like "Meg" used relaxation scripts, auditory stimulation, and binaural beats to access different brain wave states, with exercises tracked for accuracy using pre-known outcomes over ~2 years.
• EEG neurofeedback (called "the chair") monitored brain waves as subjects cycled through cognitive tasks; trainers focused on reinforcing theta and especially gamma spike durations.
• Random Number Generators (RNGs) tied to quantum events (radioactive isotope decay, double-slit) were used to test psychic influence; Jordan and other children reportedly pushed outputs by multitudes of standard deviations and held them for hours using thought alone.
• Bob Jahn's PEAR lab at Princeton (1978–2007) was cited as having concluded "without a shadow of a doubt" the effect was real, and his plasma propulsion work exists in current satellites.

UAP Piloting & the Prometheus System

Jordan states UAPs are flown not with joysticks but through highly telepathic consciousness linkage via the Prometheus system (named by him after the Greek bringer of fire). Piloting involved disembodiment into the craft and a split-screen mental technique to control movement.

• UAPs are reportedly flown not with joysticks but through highly telepathic consciousness linkage via the Prometheus system; EEG monitoring recorded brain wave signals during piloting sessions.
• Piloting involved lying in deep meditation, often aided by a sedative and auditory aids, then shifting consciousness out of the body and into the craft.
• A "split screen video game" mental technique was used: third-person perspective of the object on the left hemisphere and first-person forward view on the right, with flip-flopping between the two to make the craft move up, down, left, right.
• Prometheus aimed to build a machine neural interface that could reproduce those signals for non-gifted operators.
• Jake Barber (pen name Alva Douglas) coined the term "P3s" (people with psionic predisposition potentials) for those who pilot UAPs, noting pharmacological aids were used as a "euphemism" for being drugged.
• Barber's book Sentinels of Ether focuses on neural interfaces between brain and UAP craft; the Pentagon reportedly censored seven pages.
• Jordan underwent ~2 years of preparation before his program would have moved to full-time piloting, but it did not proceed to that point for him.
• Barber, an Air Force combat control helicopter pilot reportedly "sheep-dipped" out of the traditional special forces pipeline, retrieved at least two craft (one octagonal, one egg-shaped) for a contractor that open-source research suggests was Northrop Grumman.

UAPs as Transdimensional Phenomena

Both Jordan and Jesse favor an interdimensional explanation, with UAPs possibly projecting from a 7th-dimensional awareness and manifesting in 3D as plasma orbs or craft. Directed energy weapons are theorized to play a key role in materializing these otherwise non-physical objects.

• Jordan and Jesse agree UAPs are likely transdimensional projections (possibly from a 7th-dimensional awareness) manifesting in the third dimension as plasma orbs, crafts, etc.
• Directed energy weapons hitting a UAP may create a local electric field that forces the object to materialize and densify in physical form.
• Jordan claims high confidence that crash retrieval programs have shot UAPs with directed energy.
• He prefers the interdimensional explanation over extraterrestrial, noting awareness evolved to 4th–7th dimensions may no longer require an ego or body.
• Legacy crash retrievals reportedly use psionic operators to lure UAPs into a "honeypot" of loving interaction before striking with directed energy weapons to materialize and recover the craft.

Project Preserve Destiny & Covert Programs

Jordan was briefed on a program called "Project Preserve Destiny," in which his mother was allegedly abducted while pregnant and he was genetically altered as a fetus to enhance psychic predisposition for communicating with NHI. He has since provided names and locations to multiple Senate and intelligence contacts with no resulting action.

• Jordan was briefed on "Project Preserve Destiny," in which his mother was allegedly abducted while pregnant and he was genetically altered as a fetus to enhance psychic predisposition for communicating with NHI.
• He holds Aesus/Rh negative blood and cites disputed correlations with clairvoyance.
• He reverse-identified one of "Sherman's" bases as San Vito de Normandy (San Vito dei Normanni) in southern Italy, with a second in Nebraska.
• A "very high up" anonymous government source corroborated Sherman's story.
• Dan Hog is described as a former Director of National Intelligence electronics intelligence professional; contractor involvement allegedly traces to Odyssey Systems and MITRE Corporation, and Congressman Eric Burlison gave MITRE ~45 days to open records.
• Andre Puharic ran "ideal space kids" research in upstate NY using Faraday cages.
• The GATE program was started by Sydney Marland in 1972 (pre-Church Committee); Jordan argues GATE itself is benign but is used as an identifier pool to select children for covert programs.

Disclosure, Skywatcher & Key Figures

Jordan has worked alongside David Grusch (who reported to Congress around 2023–2024) and Jake Barber, providing names and locations to past Senate Select Intelligence Committee members and numerous three-letter agencies with no resulting action. He led psionic operations for Skywatcher before departing in July, believing disclosure needs more public engagement and less military involvement.

• Jordan has provided names and locations to past Senate Select Intelligence Committee members and numerous three-letter agencies, working alongside David Grusch and Jake Barber, with no resulting action.
• He led psionic operations for Skywatcher (founded by Barber, with James Fowler and Alex), but left in July, believing disclosure needs less military involvement and more public, next-generation engagement.
• Psionic operations sessions eliciting UAP responses were not 100% successful, but when responses occurred they were consistently described as benign, neutral, and loving; by contrast, a mechanistic/militaristic approach produced aggressive responses nearly 100% of the time.
• Jordan had a January 2023 suicide attempt as memories returned, flew to DC, met Ross Coulthart in 2024, and was introduced to Barber around June 2024 before Barber went public.
• The legacy program is described as a "far smaller club than most people think" with deep compartmentalization.
• A 2024 exercise at Esalen Institute was referenced, where participants reportedly observed plasma and blue orbs rising from the ocean within ~50 yards, drawing parallels to shamanic and Native American traditions of communicating with blue light for thousands of years.

Consciousness, Quantum Physics & Philosophy

The discussion draws on figures including Don Hoffman, Schrödinger, Penrose, and Hameroff to frame consciousness as the substrate of reality. Both speakers acknowledge that consciousness-collapse claims remain unfalsifiable under current experimental paradigms.

• Don Hoffman (UC Irvine) on disembodied consciousness is cited, with the framing that "disembodiment is more adaptive."
• Schrödinger's 1944 "What is Life" on aperiodic DNA crystals is referenced.
• The Penrose-Hameroff microtubule model is cited as a room-temperature quantum system in human biology.
• Jordan describes a working quantum computer as theoretically able to send future-state information backward in time, with cryogenic cooling as the current bottleneck.
• Consciousness is analogized to a stylus on an LP record — all paths exist, awareness chooses in the present.
• Jordan discusses "pre-sentiment" (precognitive dreams) as evolutionarily adaptive.
• The Copenhagen interpretation and delayed choice experiment are cited; both speakers acknowledge consciousness-collapse claims are unfalsifiable.

Goethe, Steiner & "Cognition by Identification"

Goethe's visit to Strasbourg Cathedral produced a prediction that the next paradigm shift would be "cognition by identification" — understanding by embodying the studied object. Rudolf Steiner elaborated on this concept roughly 100 years later in Goethe's Theory of Knowledge.

• Goethe visited Strasbourg Cathedral and experienced a merging with the structure, predicting the next paradigm shift would be "cognition by identification" — understanding by embodying the studied object.
• Rudolf Steiner (~100 years later) wrote Goethe's Theory of Knowledge elaborating on this concept.
• Jordan draws a direct parallel between Goethe's concept and techniques from a covert program involving disembodiment and re-embodiment of target objects (such as doors, filing cabinets, or rooms).

Neuroscience & Group Coherence

The Yelin experience involved ~30 people outdoors listening to a 30-minute synchronized playlist of binaural beats, producing group coherence in which random number generators reportedly shifted sigmas and NHI appeared as a byproduct. Gary Nolan's caudate/putamen neuron density correlations were also discussed as a potential biological marker.

• Gary Nolan (Stanford microbiologist) reportedly correlates high neuronal density in the caudate nucleus and putamen with psychic abilities and more frequent UAP encounters.
• The Yelin experience involved ~30 people outdoors listening to a 30-minute synchronized playlist of binaural beats and frequencies, producing group coherence.
• In such group-coherence environments, random number generators (RNGs) are said to shift sigmas, and NHI appears as a byproduct rather than the focus.
• Robert Monroe's hemisync (slightly off binaural beats entraining brain synchronization) was pioneered at the Monroe Institute in Virginia, documented in a 1985/1986 CIA FOIA document.

Children, Communication & Literature

Jordan was shown a non-verbal autistic child named Ken from Baker Victory and told "we can find you through them," drawing parallels to Arthur C. Clarke's Childhood's End and Kai Dickens' Telepathy Tapes. Both works depict NHI communicating only with non-verbal autistic children, suggesting a recurrent theme across science fiction and apparent real-world programs.

• During an astral experience Jordan was shown a non-verbal autistic child named Ken from Baker Victory, told "we can find you through them."
• Arthur C. Clarke's Childhood's End depicts aliens communicating only with autistic nonverbal children.
• Kai Dickens' podcast Telepathy Tapes covers non-verbal autistic children displaying knowledge (e.g., Egyptian hieroglyphics) unattainable through inductive logic.
• Jordan claims dissociation is the least-studied trauma response per Psychology Today; he references Carl Jung merging spirituality with psychology before the field shifted to the DSM.

Disclosure as Renaissance & Future Path

Jordan contrasts a "left-hand path" of individual hidden knowledge (repeatedly ending in disaster) with a "right-hand path" of collective embodiment, arguing the latter is opening for the first time in history. He frames disclosure as a potential "brand new renaissance" requiring new physics, public engagement, and support for survivor communities.

• Three orb theories offered: (1) extraterrestrial, (2) interdimensional (Jordan's preference), (3) mirror back of us — possibly all simultaneously true.
• Jordan contrasts a "left-hand path" (individual hidden knowledge, repeatedly ending in disaster) with a "right-hand path" (collective embodiment), arguing the right-hand path is opening up for the first time in history.
• He warns that turning sacred things into a business backfires, citing Lord of the Rings, Prometheus, Faust, and an Old Testament line.
• The underlying mechanism connecting consciousness to physics may reside inside humans and may not be discoverable in a standard lab.
• Jordan calls for frontier-thinking clinicians and people with "clean conscious capital" to support survivors.

Show Announcements & Resources

American Alchemy host Jesse announced that the show is hiring an editor with YouTube, podcast, trailer, documentary, or Hollywood experience, with bonus consideration for candidates genuinely into UFOs, consciousness, and frontier science.

• American Alchemy is hiring an editor (YouTube, podcast, trailer, documentary, or Hollywood experience); applications go to apply@jesseichelsmedia.com.
• Jordan's Telepathy Center app is set to release in June at telepathycenter.com; his bio is at jordanjos.com.